ECHR decision

DEUXIÈME SECTION
DÉCISION
SUR LA RECEVABILITÉ
de la requête no 15869/09
présentée par Ahmet Tuncay ÖZKAN
contre la Turquie
La Cour européenne des droits de l’homme (deuxième section), siégeant le 13 décembre 2011 en une Chambre composée de :
Françoise Tulkens, présidente,
Danutė Jočienė,
Dragoljub Popović,
Işıl Karakaş,
Guido Raimondi,
Paulo Pinto de Albuquerque,
Helen Keller, juges,
et de Stanley Naismith, greffier de section,
Vu la requête susmentionnée introduite le 24 février 2009,
Après en avoir délibéré, rend la décision suivante :
EN FAIT
Le requérant, M. Ahmet Tuncay Özkan, est un ressortissant turc, né en 1966 et résidant à Istanbul. Il est représenté devant la Cour par Me A. Çörtoglu, avocat à Ankara. A l’époque des faits, il était journaliste, propriétaire de la chaîne de télévision Kanaltürk et président du parti politique « Nouveau Parti ».
A. Les circonstances de l’espèce
Les faits de la cause, tels qu’ils ont été exposés par le requérant, peuvent se résumer comme suit.
1. Le procès Ergenekon
En 2007, le parquet d’Istanbul engagea une enquête pénale contre les membres présumés d’une organisation criminelle du nom d’« Ergenekon », tous soupçonnés de se livrer à des activités visant à renverser le Gouvernement élu par la force et la violence. Selon le parquet, les accusés auraient planifié et commis des actes de provocation, comme des attentats contre des personnalités connues du public, des attaques à la bombe dans des endroits sensibles comme les locaux de sanctuaires ou de hautes juridictions. Ils auraient ainsi visé à générer une atmosphère de peur et de panique dans l’opinion publique et par là même à créer un climat d’insécurité, de manière à ouvrir la voie à un coup d’Etat militaire.
Par plusieurs actes d’accusation, le parquet d’Istanbul intenta des actions pénales devant la cour d’assises d’Istanbul contre plusieurs personnes, dont des généraux et des officiers de l’armée, des membres des services de renseignement, des hommes d’affaires, des politiciens et des journalistes. Il leur reprocha d’avoir planifié un coup d’Etat dans le but de renverser l’ordre constitutionnel démocratique, crime passible d’une peine d’emprisonnement à perpétuité, principalement en vertu de l’article 312 du code pénal.
Il ressort des actes d’accusation que le premier indice révélant l’existence de l’organisation clandestine Ergenekon aurait été la découverte d’une cache d’armes (26 grenades d’assaut) lors d’une perquisition effectuée en juin 2007 à Ümraniye, un quartier d’Istanbul. Lors de plusieurs perquisitions effectuées dans le cadre de la même enquête, des éléments de preuve mettant en lumière la structure hiérarchique de l’organisation ainsi que ses plans d’actions tendant à renverser le Gouvernement par la force auraient été saisis.
Le parquet expliqua dans les actes d’accusation déposés dans le cadre de cette affaire que, selon la structure hiérarchique de l’Ergenekon, les militaires étaient considérés comme les principaux acteurs de l’organisation et que les civils étaient plutôt chargés de fournir des moyens logistiques et financiers et de faire de la propagande.
Par ailleurs, toujours selon le parquet, le réseau incriminé avait établi, pour mener ses activités, des plans d’action concrets, dont certains avaient pu être dévoilés. Trois de ces plans d’action, Kafes (la cage), Irtica ile mücadele (la lutte contre le fondamentalisme) et Sarıkız (la blonde), concernaient la période antérieure au coup d’Etat militaire et avaient comme objectif principal la préparation du terrain en vue de justifier cette intervention. Le plan d’action Yakamoz (le reflet de la lune dans l’eau) portait sur l’exécution du coup d’Etat militaire en tant que tel. Enfin, le plan d’action Eldiven (le gant) portait sur la restructuration du pouvoir gouvernemental et des institutions politiques pendant la période postérieure au coup d’Etat militaire.
Le plan d’action Kafes prévoyait, dans un premier temps, que les membres de l’organisation accomplissent des actes de violence contre les citoyens appartenant aux minorités religieuses, tels que des menaces par téléphone et des slogans écrits sur les murs, la pose d’explosifs dans les quartiers où habitaient majoritairement ces personnes, des attentats contre les défenseurs des droits des minorités connus du public, et, finalement, des enlèvements d’hommes d’affaires et d’artistes membres des ces minorités. La deuxième étape du plan Kafes visait à manipuler les médias afin que l’AKP, le parti au pouvoir, fût accusé d’avoir commandité ces actes de violence.
Le plan d’action pour lutter contre le fondamentalisme (irtica ile mücadele eylem planı) prévoyait en particulier la diffusion par le biais des médias de fausses nouvelles concernant l’AKP, le parti au pouvoir, afin de ternir son image et de lui faire perdre son soutien auprès de l’opinion publique.
Le plan d’action Sarıkız, tel qu’exposé dans le journal tenu par l’ancien commandant en chef de la marine, l’amiral Ö. Ö., prévoyait de manipuler la presse et d’inciter des étudiants, des membres des syndicats et des associations à organiser des manifestations de protestation contre le gouvernement et de mettre en œuvre des campagnes d’affichage à l’échelle nationale afin de faire croire à un mécontentement général contre le gouvernement. Ce plan d’action aurait été élaboré par les généraux de l’armée M. Ş. E., A. Y., Ö. Ö. et İ. F.
Le plan d’action Ayışığı (le clair de lune) visait principalement à évincer ou à neutraliser le chef d’état-major, le général de l’armée H. Ö., qui était réputé pour être hostile à toute action antidémocratique. Le plan avait également pour but de faire quitter leur parti à un certain nombre de députés de l’AKP, le parti au pouvoir. Un autre objectif de ce plan était de s’assurer du soutien du président de la République à un putsch militaire contre le gouvernement, ou à neutraliser toute opposition de sa part.
Le plan d’action Yakamoz portait notamment sur l’exécution du coup d’Etat militaire et la mise en place de nouvelles administrations après le renversement du gouvernement.
Le plan d’action Eldiven concernait les mesures spécifiques à prendre après la réussite du putsch militaire contre le gouvernement. Ce plan d’action portait sur la restructuration des médias et des formations politiques, la réorganisation des forces armées, l’élection d’un nouveau président de la République, la réorganisation des institutions dépendant de la présidence et la réorientation de la politique extérieure.
D’après le parquet, les plans d’action Ayışığı, Yakamoz et Eldiven, qui étaient décrits dans des CD appartenant au général de l’armée M. Ş. E., avaient été élaborés par celui-ci et par son équipe comprenant des militaires haut gradés.
A la demande du parquet, la cour d’assises d’Istanbul – devant laquelle les procédures sont toujours pendantes – ordonna la mise et le maintien en détention provisoire de la plupart des accusés.
2. L’arrestation du requérant et la procédure pénale engagée contre lui
Le 23 septembre 2008, les officiers de police d’Istanbul arrêtèrent le requérant et le placèrent en garde à vue. Ils l’informèrent qu’il était soupçonné d’être membre d’une organisation terroriste connue sous le nom d’Ergenekon et d’avoir mené des activités au nom de cette organisation.
L’interrogatoire de l’intéressé commença à la Direction de la sûreté d’Istanbul le 25 septembre 2008 à 22h30, et dura sans interruption jusqu’au lendemain à 18h00. A la fin, le requérant se sentait épuisé et il avait faim et soif. Lors de l’interrogatoire, les policiers interrogèrent le requérant notamment sur la structure d’Ergenekon et les relations entres ses membres. Ils lui posèrent aussi des questions sur ses activités associatives et politiques et sur ses connaissances dans les médias, l’armée, la police et la justice. Une partie de l’interrogatoire porta également sur les conversations téléphoniques du requérant avec les autres membres présumés de l’organisation.
Le 27 septembre 2008, le procureur de la République (« le procureur ») d’Istanbul, après avoir entendu le requérant, le traduisit devant le juge assesseur près la cour d’assises spéciale, en maintenant les mêmes charges que celles qui avaient été formulées lors des interrogatoires par la police. Le juge assesseur ordonna la mise en détention provisoire du requérant.
Par un acte d’accusation déposé le 8 mars 2009 devant la cour d’assises d’Istanbul, le procureur accusa le requérant d’être un membre actif de l’organisation criminelle connue sous le nom d’Ergenekon. Selon le parquet, le requérant était sous l’autorité directe de certains militaires de l’organisation Ergenekon. Le procureur soutint que dans le cadre de son appartenance à celle-ci, le requérant s’était procuré illégalement plusieurs procès verbaux et documents issus du Conseil de la sécurité nationale (Milli Güvenlik Kurulu) et du Service national des renseignements (MIT) tous classés « secrets », avait fondé une chaîne de télévision sous le nom de Kanaltürk afin de diffuser des informations émanant de l’organisation Ergenekon et avait illégalement détenu à son domicile des explosifs (une grenade et des capsules de grenade) et des balles. A l’appui de ses accusations, le procureur présenta à la cour d’assises, comme éléments de preuve, les documents et le matériel saisis lors des perquisitions effectuées aux domiciles de l’intéressé et de ses coaccusés ainsi que des comptes-rendus d’écoutes téléphoniques. Finalement, le procureur requit la condamnation du requérant en vertu des articles 311 § 1, 312 § 1, 314 § 1, 327 § 1, 334 § 1 du code pénal et de l’article 13 § 1 de la loi no 6136 sur les armes à feu et les armes blanches.
Entre le 6 novembre 2008 et le 1er décembre 2009, le requérant forma des recours afin de s’opposer à sa détention provisoire et demander sa mise en liberté provisoire. Il exposa notamment que les éléments de preuve invoqués par le parquet ne venaient aucunement à l’appui des accusations selon lesquelles il serait membre d’une organisation terroriste. Toutefois, la cour d’assises d’Istanbul rejeta les recours de l’intéressé en se fondant sur les motifs suivants : la nature des infractions reprochées à l’intéressé, les forts soupçons pesant sur lui, le risque de fuite, l’état des éléments de preuve et le risque de destruction de ces derniers, et l’hypothèse que des mesures alternatives à la détention ne seraient pas suffisantes afin d’assurer la participation du requérant à la procédure pénale.
A l’heure actuelle, l’affaire est encore pendante devant la cour d’assises d’Istanbul et le requérant est détenu à la maison d’arrêt de Silivri.
B. Le droit interne pertinent
1. Les dispositions du code pénal
L’article 311 § 1 du code pénal se lit ainsi :
« Quiconque tente de renverser la Grande Assemblée Nationale de Turquie par la force et la violence ou de l’empêcher partiellement ou totalement d’exercer ses fonctions sera condamné à la réclusion à perpétuité ».
L’article 312 § 1 du code pénal est ainsi libellé :
« Quiconque tente de renverser le gouvernement de la République de Turquie par la force et la violence ou de l’empêcher partiellement ou totalement d’exercer ses fonctions sera condamné à la réclusion à perpétuité ».
L’article 314 §§ 1 et 2 du code pénal, qui prévoit le délit d’appartenance à une organisation illégale, se lit comme suit :
« 1. Quiconque constitue ou dirige une organisation en vue de commettre les infractions prévues par les quatrième et cinquième sections du présent chapitre sera condamné à une peine de dix à quinze ans d’emprisonnement.
2. Tout membre de l’organisation mentionnée au premier alinéa sera condamné à une peine de cinq à dix ans d’emprisonnement ».
L’article 327 § 1 du code pénal dispose :
« Quiconque se procure des informations qui doivent rester secrètes pour des raisons liées à la sécurité de l’Etat ou à ses intérêts politiques extérieurs ou intérieurs est condamné à une peine de trois à huit ans d’emprisonnement ».
L’article 334 § 1 du code pénal prévoit :
« Quiconque se procure des informations dont les autorités compétentes ont interdit la divulgation conformément à la loi et aux dispositions en la matière et qui doivent par nature rester confidentielles est condamné à une peine de un à trois ans d’emprisonnement ».
2. Les dispositions du code de procédure pénale
L’article 91 § 2 du code de procédure pénale stipule :
« Le placement en garde à vue dépend de la nécessité de cette mesure pour l’enquête et des indices permettant de croire que l’intéressé a commis une infraction ».
La détention provisoire est régie par les articles 100 et suivants du code de procédure pénale. D’après l’article 100, une personne peut être mise en détention provisoire lorsqu’il existe des faits démontrant l’existence de forts soupçons qu’elle a commis une infraction et que la détention provisoire est justifiée par l’un des motifs énumérés dans cette disposition. La détention provisoire est considérée comme justifiée en cas de fuite et de risque de fuite, ou lorsque le suspect risque de dissimuler ou de modifier des preuves ou d’influencer des témoins. L’existence de forts soupçons que le suspect a commis certains crimes, notamment contre la sécurité de l’Etat et l’ordre constitutionnel, peut également justifier la détention provisoire.
L’article 101 du code de procédure pénale prévoit que la détention provisoire est ordonnée au stade de l’instruction par le juge unique à la demande du procureur de la République, et au stade du jugement par le tribunal compétent, d’office ou à la demande du procureur. Les ordonnances de mise et de maintien en détention provisoire peuvent faire l’objet d’une opposition. Les décisions y relatives doivent être motivées en droit et en fait.
D’après l’article 104 du code, le prévenu ou l’inculpé peut demander à tout moment de la procédure à être libéré. L’ordonnance de maintien en détention ou de libération est prise par un juge ou par un tribunal. La décision de rejeter la demande de remise en liberté est également susceptible d’opposition.
GRIEFS
Invoquant l’article 3 de la Convention, le requérant allègue que la durée de son interrogatoire à la Direction de la sûreté et les conditions dans lesquelles cet interrogatoire s’est déroulé s’analysent en un traitement inhumain et dégradant à son égard.
Invoquant l’article 5 § 1 de la Convention, le requérant se plaint que sa privation de liberté n’est pas conforme à la législation interne ni à la Convention puisqu’il été arrêté et détenu en l’absence de raisons plausibles de le soupçonner d’avoir commis une infraction pénale.
Par ailleurs, le requérant soutient au regard de l’article 5 § 2 de la Convention qu’à la suite de son arrestation il n’a été informé ni des raisons de celle-ci ni des accusations portées contre lui.
Sous l’angle de l’article 5 § 3 de la Convention, le requérant allègue que la durée de sa détention provisoire, actuellement plus de trois ans, est excessive.
Invoquant les articles 5 § 4 et 13 de la Convention, le requérant se plaint aussi de l’absence d’un recours effectif pour contester son maintien en détention provisoire. Il reproche aux autorités judiciaires de rejeter ses demandes de libération sans respecter l’égalité des armes ni tenir d’audience.
Invoquant l’article 6 § 1 de la Convention, le requérant dénonce en premier lieu la durée excessive de la procédure pénale engagée contre lui.
Invoquant l’article 6 § 1 de la Convention, pris isolément ou combiné avec son article 13, le requérant se plaint enfin qu’il ne bénéficie pas d’un procès équitable devant un tribunal indépendant et impartial - aux motifs que les magistrats de siège chargés du dossier auraient des liens étroits avec le parquet et la police judiciaire et qu’ils seraient soumis à l’autorité du Conseil supérieur de la magistrature, la formation présidée par le ministre de la Justice - et qu’il ne dispose pas d’un recours effectif en droit interne par lequel il aurait pu contester cette situation.
EN DROIT
1. Le requérant allègue que la durée de sa détention n’est pas raisonnable au sens de l’article 5 § 3 de la Convention.
Par ailleurs, invoquant les articles 5 § 4 et 13 de la Convention, le requérant se plaint de n’avoir pas disposé en droit interne d’un recours effectif pour contester son maintien en détention provisoire. Il fait observer que, lorsqu’elles ont statué sur ses demandes de mise en liberté, les autorités judiciaires n’ont pas respecté les principes du contradictoire et de l’égalité des armes.
En l’état actuel du dossier, la Cour estime ne pas être en mesure de se prononcer sur la recevabilité de ces griefs et juge nécessaire de les communiquer au gouvernement défendeur, en vertu de l’article 54 § 2 b) de son règlement.
2. Invoquant l’article 5 § 1 de la Convention, le requérant se plaint également d’avoir été arrêté et détenu en l’absence de raisons plausibles de le soupçonner d’avoir commis une infraction pénale.
La Cour note que le requérant prétend que son arrestation et sa détention sont contraires non seulement aux dispositions de l’article 5 § 1 c) de la Convention, mais aussi aux « voies internes » au sens de l’article 5 § 1 de la Convention, ces voies édictant des normes similaires à celles de la Convention quant à l’existence de raisons plausibles de soupçonner l’intéressé d’avoir commis une infraction pénale en matière de privation de la liberté. La Cour examinera donc le grief en premier lieu sous l’angle de la notion d’« existence de raisons plausibles » au sens de l’article 5 § 1 c) de la Convention.
La Cour rappelle que l’article 5 § 1 c) n’autorise à placer une personne en détention que dans le cadre d’une procédure pénale, en vue de la traduire devant l’autorité judiciaire compétente lorsqu’il y a des raisons plausibles de soupçonner qu’elle a commis une infraction (Ječius c. Lituanie, no 34578/97, § 50, CEDH 2000 IX et Włoch c. Pologne, no 27785/95, § 108, CEDH 2000 XI). La « plausibilité » des soupçons sur lesquels doit se fonder l’arrestation constitue un élément essentiel de la protection offerte par l’article 5 § 1 c). L’existence de soupçons plausibles présuppose celle de faits ou de renseignements propres à persuader un observateur objectif que l’individu en cause peut avoir accompli l’infraction. Ce qui peut passer pour plausible dépend toutefois de l’ensemble des circonstances (Fox, Campbell et Hartley c. Royaume-Uni, 30 août 1990, § 32, série A no 182, O’Hara c. Royaume-Uni, no 37555/97, § 34, CEDH 2001 X, Korkmaz et autres c. Turquie, no 35979/97, § 24, 21 mars 2006, Süleyman Erdem c. Turquie, no 49574/99, § 37, 19 septembre 2006, et Çelik et Yıldız c. Turquie, no 51479/99, § 20, 10 novembre 2005).
Par ailleurs, l’alinéa c) de l’article 5 § 1 ne présuppose pas que la police ait rassemblé des preuves suffisantes pour porter des accusations au moment de l’arrestation. L’objet d’un interrogatoire pendant une détention au titre de l’alinéa c) de l’article 5 § 1 est de compléter l’enquête pénale en confirmant ou en écartant les soupçons concrets fondant l’arrestation. Ainsi, les faits donnant naissance à des soupçons ne doivent pas être du même niveau que ceux qui sont nécessaires pour justifier une condamnation ou même pour porter une accusation, ce qui intervient dans la phase suivante de la procédure de l’enquête pénale (Murray c. Royaume-Uni, 28 octobre 1994, § 55, série A no 300 A et Korkmaz et autres, précité, § 26).
Il ne faut certes pas appliquer l’article 5 § 1 c) d’une manière qui causerait aux autorités de police des Etats contractants des difficultés excessives pour combattre par des mesures adéquates la criminalité organisée (voir, mutatis mutandis, Klass et autres c. Allemagne, 6 septembre 1978, §§ 58-68, série A no 28). La tâche de la Cour consiste à déterminer si les conditions fixées à l’alinéa c) de l’article 5 § 1, y compris la poursuite du but légitime prescrit, ont été remplies en l’espèce. Dans ce contexte, il ne lui appartient pas normalement de substituer sa propre appréciation des faits à celle des juridictions internes, mieux placées pour évaluer les preuves produites devant elles (Murray, précité, § 66).
En l’espèce, la Cour constate que le requérant a été privé de sa liberté car il était soupçonné d’être l’un des membres actifs d’une organisation criminelle du nom d’Ergenekon, lesquels passaient pour se livrer à des activités en vue de renverser par la violence le gouvernement. Elle observe que le requérant était soupçonné en particulier de s’être procuré illégalement plusieurs documents classés secrets provenant de certains services de l’Administration chargés de la sécurité nationale, d’avoir fondé et dirigé une chaîne de télévision afin de diffuser des émissions conçues par l’organisation Ergenekon et d’avoir détenu à son domicile des explosifs au nom de l’organisation. La Cour note aussi que des éléments de preuve tels que des comptes rendus d’écoutes téléphoniques suggérant que le requérant avait agi ainsi sur instruction des militaires de l’organisation, ainsi que des documents et du matériel saisis lors des diverses perquisitions avaient été recueillis par le parquet avant l’arrestation du requérant, sur la foi de soupçons selon lesquels celui-ci avait commis l’infraction pénale reprochée, réprimée sévèrement par le code pénal.
Il y a donc lieu de conclure que le requérant peut passer pour avoir été arrêté et détenu sur la base de « raisons plausibles de le soupçonner » d’avoir commis une infraction pénale, au sens de l’alinéa c) de l’article 5 § 1 (Murray, précité, § 63, Korkmaz et autres, précité, § 26, Süleyman Erdem, précité, § 37).
Quant à la conformité de l’arrestation du requérant aux normes du droit interne (Bozano c. France, 18 décembre 1986, § 54, série A no 111, Wassink c. Pays-Bas, 27 septembre 1990, § 24, série A no 185 A, Baranowski c. Pologne, no 28358/95, § 50, CEDH 2000 III, Mooren c. Allemagne, no 11364/03, § 72, 13 décembre 2007, et Öcalan c. Turquie [GC], no 46221/99, § 83, CEDH 2005 IV), la Cour se réfère à ses constats exposés ci-dessus. Elle observe que les autorités judiciaires nationales se sont appuyées sur des éléments de preuve concrets lorsqu’elles ont arrêté le requérant en invoquant l’existence d’indices et de raisons de le soupçonner – au sens de l’article 91 § 2 et de l’article 100 du code de procédure pénale – d’avoir commis des infractions réprimées par le code pénal et par la loi no 6136. La Cour estime donc que rien ne montre qu’en l’espèce l’interprétation et l’application des dispositions légales invoquées par les autorités internes aient été arbitraires ou déraisonnables au point de conférer à l’arrestation du requérant un caractère irrégulier.
Il s’ensuit que cette partie de la requête est manifestement mal fondée et qu’elle doit être rejetée en application de l’article 35 §§ 3 a) et 4 de la Convention.
3. Le requérant allègue par ailleurs qu’il n’a pas été informé des raisons de son arrestation et des accusations portées contre lui. Il invoque à cet égard l’article 5 § 2 de la Convention.
La Cour rappelle que le paragraphe 2 de l’article 5 énonce une garantie élémentaire : toute personne arrêtée doit savoir pourquoi. Intégré au système de protection qu’offre l’article 5, il oblige à signaler à une telle personne dans un langage simple, accessible pour elle, les raisons juridiques et factuelles de sa privation de liberté, afin qu’elle puisse en discuter la légalité devant un tribunal en vertu du paragraphe 4 (Fox, Campbell et Hartley, précité, § 40 et H.B. c. Suisse, no 26899/95, § 47, 5 avril 2001).
La Cour rappelle par ailleurs que l’article 5 § 2 n’exige pas que les raisons soient fournies par écrit à la personne détenue, ni sous quelque autre forme spéciale. Quant à l’étendue des informations, il n’est pas nécessaire, aux termes de l’article 5 § 2, de communiquer à l’accusé, lors de son arrestation, une énumération complète de toutes les accusations portées contre lui (Soysal c. Turquie, no 50091/99, § 68, 3 mai 2007).
En l’espèce, la Cour constate que lors de son arrestation, les officiers de police d’Istanbul ont informé le requérant qu’il était soupçonné d’appartenance à une organisation terroriste connue sous le nom d’Ergenekon et d’avoir mené des activités au nom de cette organisation. L’interrogatoire de l’intéressé dans les locaux de police juste après son arrestation a porté, entre autres, sur la structure de l’organisation Ergenekon, sur les relations entres ses membres et sur les conversations téléphoniques du requérant avec les autres membres présumés de l’organisation. Il ressort également du dossier que le requérant s’est référé à ces informations dans ses recours présentés à la cour d’assises d’Istanbul en vue de contester la légalité de sa détention.
La Cour estime donc qu’au moment de son arrestation, voire dès le début de sa détention, le requérant a été dûment informé « des raisons juridiques et factuelles de sa privation de liberté, afin qu’[il] [pût] en discuter la légalité devant un tribunal » (Fox, Campbell et Hartley, précité, § 40 et H.B., précité, § 49).
Il s’ensuit que cette partie de la requête est également manifestement mal fondée et qu’elle doit être rejetée en application de l’article 35 §§ 3 a) et 4 de la Convention.
4. Le requérant allègue en outre que la durée de son interrogatoire à la Direction de la sûreté et les conditions dans lesquelles cet interrogatoire s’est déroulé s’analysent en un traitement inhumain et dégradant au sens de l’article 3 de la Convention.
La Cour rappelle que pour tomber sous le coup de l’article 3, un traitement doit atteindre un minimum de gravité dont l’appréciation dépend de l’ensemble des données de la cause, notamment de la durée du traitement et de ses effets physiques ou mentaux ainsi que, parfois, du sexe, de l’âge, de l’état de santé de la victime, etc. (voir, par exemple, Irlande c. Royaume Uni, 18 janvier 1978, § 162, série A no 25). De plus, la Cour, afin d’apprécier la valeur des éléments de preuve devant elle dans l’établissement des traitements contraires à l’article 3, se sert du critère de la preuve « au-delà de tout doute raisonnable ». Une telle preuve peut résulter d’un faisceau d’indices, ou de présomptions non réfutées, suffisamment graves, précis et concordants (ibidem, pp. 64-65, § 161).
En particulier, un traitement est « inhumain » au sens de l’article 3 notamment s’il a été appliqué avec préméditation pendant une longue durée, et s’il a causé soit des lésions corporelles, soit de vives souffrances physiques ou mentales (voir, entre autres, Kudła c. Pologne [GC], no 30210/96, § 92, CEDH 2000-XI). En outre, en recherchant si un traitement est « dégradant » au sens de l’article 3, la Cour examinera si le but était d’humilier et de rabaisser l’intéressé et si, considérée dans ses effets, la mesure a ou non atteint la personnalité de celui-ci d’une manière incompatible avec l’article 3 (Albert et Le Compte c. Belgique, 10 février 1983, § 22, série A no 58). Pour que l’arrestation ou la détention d’une personne dans le cadre d’une poursuite judiciaire soient dégradantes au sens de l’article 3, l’humiliation ou l’avilissement dont elles s’accompagnent doivent se situer à un niveau particulier et différer en tout cas de l’élément habituel d’humiliation inhérent à chaque arrestation ou détention (Öcalan, précité, § 181, mutatis mutandis, Raninen c. Finlande, 16 décembre 1997, § 55, Recueil des arrêts et décisions 1997-VIII).
En l’espèce, la Cour considère que devant elle, l’intéressé n’a produit aucune preuve ni invoqué aucun indice permettant de conclure que la durée de son interrogatoire et les conditions dans lesquelles cet interrogatoire a eu lieu ont atteint le seuil de gravité requis par l’article 3 (voir, dans le même sens, Erda et autres c. Turquie (déc.), no 499/02, 1er juin 2006).
Il s’ensuit que ce grief est également manifestement mal fondé et qu’il doit être rejeté en application de l’article 35 §§ 3 a) et 4 de la Convention.
5. Invoquant l’article 6 § 1 de la Convention, le requérant se plaint de la durée excessive de la procédure.
La Cour note que la période à prendre en considération a commencé le 23 septembre 2008, date de l’arrestation du requérant. La procédure est encore pendante devant la cour d’assises spéciale. A ce jour, elle a donc duré un peu plus de trois ans.
La Cour rappelle sa jurisprudence constante selon laquelle le caractère raisonnable de la durée d’une procédure doit s’apprécier suivant les circonstances de la cause et eu égard aux critères suivants : la complexité de l’affaire, le comportement du requérant et des autorités compétentes ainsi que l’enjeu du litige pour l’intéressé (voir, entre autres, Sürmeli c. Allemagne [GC], no 75529/01, § 128, CEDH 2006-VII, McFarlane c. Irlande [GC], no 31333/06, § 140, 10 septembre 2010).
La Cour estime que l’affaire revêtait une complexité certaine, comme en témoignent, d’une part, la grande quantité de pièces à conviction auxquelles se réfère l’acte d’accusation dirigé contre le requérant et, d’autre part, un grand nombre de coaccusés.
Pour ce qui est du comportement des autorités, la Cour relève que le parquet a présenté son acte d’accusation moins de six mois après l’arrestation du requérant. Elle constate par ailleurs que le requérant ne fait pas observer l’existence de périodes d’inactivité importantes lors du déroulement de la procédure devant la cour d’assises d’Istanbul et qu’il ne parvient pas à mettre utilement en doute la célérité des autorités judiciaires.
Par conséquent, tenant compte de l’ensemble des circonstances de l’espèce, et notamment de la complexité du litige, la Cour estime que la durée de la procédure, prise globalement, n’a pas excédé, à ce jour, un délai raisonnable, au sens de l’article 6 § 1.
Il s’ensuit que ce grief doit aussi être rejeté comme manifestement mal fondé au sens de l’article 35 §§ 3 a) et 4 de la Convention.
6. Invoquant l’article 6 § 1, pris isolément ou combiné avec l’article 13 de la Convention, le requérant se plaint enfin qu’il ne bénéficie pas d’un procès équitable devant un tribunal indépendant et impartial et qu’il ne dispose pas d’un recours effectif en droit interne par lequel il aurait pu contester cette situation.
Toutefois, la Cour relève que la procédure pénale engagée contre le requérant est toujours pendante devant la cour d’assises d’Istanbul, première instance en la matière. Elle n’est donc pas en mesure de procéder à un examen global du procès ouvert contre le requérant. La Cour estime en outre ne pouvoir spéculer ni sur ce que décidera la cour d’assises quant aux accusations portées contre le requérant, ni sur l’issue d’un pourvoi en cassation éventuel.
Il s’ensuit qu’au stade actuel de la procédure devant les juridictions internes, le requérant ne saurait donc se plaindre d’une quelconque violation des dispositions de l’article 6 de la Convention. Il lui est toutefois loisible de saisir à nouveau la Cour s’il estime toujours, à l’issue de la procédure pénale engagée contre lui, qu’il est victime des violations alléguées. Cette partie de la requête est donc prématurée (voir, entre autres, Baltacı c. Turquie (déc.), no 495/02, 14 juin 2005).
Vu ses constats relatifs à l’article 6 § 1, la Cour juge inutile d’examiner l’affaire sous l’angle de l’article 13 de la Convention ; les exigences de cette disposition sont en effet moins strictes que celles de l’article 6 § 1 et absorbées par elles en l’espèce (voir, par exemple, Hentrich c. France, 22 septembre 1994, § 65, série A no 296 A).
Il convient donc de rejeter également cette partie de la requête comme étant manifestement mal fondée en application des articles 35 §§ 3 a) et 4 de la Convention.




Par ces motifs, la Cour, à l’unanimité,
Ajourne l’examen des griefs du requérant tirés de l’article 5 §§ 3 et 4 de la Convention et concernant la durée de la détention provisoire et la prétendue absence de recours effectif pour contester cette durée ;
Déclare la requête irrecevable pour le surplus.

Stanley Naismith Françoise Tulkens
Greffier Présidente

Does anyone know of an apartment like this?

I'm looking for an apartment in Istanbul that has all of the following qualities:

*3-year lease

*Within 10-15 minutes walking distance to Taksim (Gümüşsuyu is probably ideal)

*Unfurnished, or little furniture

*Properly reinforced for earthquakes, soil and foundation report must be available, and the landlord must be willing to show them to me. ABSOLUTELY NON-NEGOTIABLE.

*Landlord friendly to cats.

*About 100 sq m.

*Very light, not claustrophobic, feeling of space

*Quiet: No construction nearby or planned--also non-negotiable.

*Sea view--I work at home, and I want to see something beautiful when I look out the window.

*A balcony that's structurally such that I could enclose it with mesh or wire, making it a place my cats can go without falling off and killing themselves

*There must be doors that close on the kitchen and at least one of the rooms that could serve as a study for me--open plan isn't suitable. I need to be able to keep the cats away from computer cords and gas stoves when I can't supervise them.

*Landlord has no prior history of major disputes with tenants or failure to do reasonable repairs in a timely fashion (in other words: NO CRAZY LANDLORDS.)

*Ready to move in immediately--no major renovations or repairs required

*Bathtub--not just a shower

*Safe neighborhood that would feel okay to walk in by myself at night, with appropriate building security (e.g., bars on ground floor windows, if any)

The above are non-negotiable, "nice to have" would include:

*no emlak, direct from landlord

*more than one balcony (one for the cats, one for the plants)

*elevator if it's on a high floor

*lots of closets and storage space

I'm willing to pay someone a reasonable fee to help me find this quickly. Get in touch with me or leave a comment if you know of something suitable.

The main consideration here is that I need to move very quickly, and can't take time off of work. So I don't want to see apartments that don't meet the criteria above.

Thanks!

4/23/2010 Skype Meeting Transcript

Jor El believes in transparency. Here's what we talk about when you're not around.



[4/23/2010 11:55:41 AM] *** Ayse Sumer added Claire Berlinski, ivan10000, Knut Milbredt, Okan Altiparmak, Asli Suner ***
[4/23/2010 11:55:49 AM] Ayse Sumer: Hello all
[4/23/2010 11:56:13 AM] Ayse Sumer: Are we ready to start the conversation?
[4/23/2010 11:56:20 AM] Suha Ülgen: Hello.
[4/23/2010 11:56:50 AM] Ayse Sumer: it looks like its just 4 of us - Claire is having trouble with her connection and will go in and out
[4/23/2010 11:57:00 AM] Ayse Sumer: Viktor are you there?
[4/23/2010 11:57:04 AM] ivan10000: Im here.. listening..
[4/23/2010 11:57:25 AM] Ayse Sumer: great did you all read the latest postings on the discussion board re ngo status?
[4/23/2010 11:57:41 AM] Suha Ülgen: No. I didn't.
[4/23/2010 11:57:58 AM] Ayse Sumer: The Turkish lawyer and the US lawyer gave their recommendations......I suggest that you look at it while we are talking
[4/23/2010 11:58:13 AM] Suha Ülgen: Thanks. I'll look at it.
[4/23/2010 11:59:03 AM] Ayse Sumer: My conversation with the US lawyer was interesting - there are some details that we need to iron out on both sides but the essence is that he recommends that we become a US charitable organization
[4/23/2010 11:59:18 AM] Ayse Sumer: that will give us a tax exempt status rather than be an ngo
[4/23/2010 11:59:47 AM] Ayse Sumer: we can receive donations and the donors can use that for tax purposes
[4/23/2010 12:00:22 PM] Ayse Sumer: I need to find someone who knows the tax exempt status application which apparently is the difficult process
[4/23/2010 12:01:50 PM] Ayse Sumer: In the meantime Asli is communicating with the lawyer in Turkey. While those discussions are going I have started looking and talking to some potential celebrity endorsers
[4/23/2010 12:02:05 PM] Ayse Sumer: Viktor how is your fund raising concert coming along?
[4/23/2010 12:02:16 PM] ivan10000: oh
[4/23/2010 12:02:20 PM] ivan10000: that' sjust a litle party
[4/23/2010 12:02:27 PM] ivan10000: there is going to be a big concert
[4/23/2010 12:02:38 PM] ivan10000: in june.. not announced yet
[4/23/2010 12:02:45 PM] ivan10000: this is the warm up
[4/23/2010 12:02:47 PM] Ayse Sumer: I seriously would like to try and organize one for Jor EL
[4/23/2010 12:03:03 PM] Ayse Sumer: where and who is helping you?
[4/23/2010 12:03:37 PM] ivan10000: a concert promoter who approached us and volunteer to do this because he loves dogs.. this is what I tried
[4/23/2010 12:03:42 PM] ivan10000: to bring the other day into the pic
[4/23/2010 12:03:48 PM] ivan10000: the larger your community
[4/23/2010 12:03:54 PM] ivan10000: the bigger possibilities it creates
[4/23/2010 12:04:04 PM] ivan10000: if we had to pay for ANYTHING there would be no LEt's Adopt
[4/23/2010 12:04:36 PM] ivan10000: on the other hand as fund raising events dont really work..
[4/23/2010 12:04:36 PM] Ayse Sumer: that is great the concert and celebrity endorser I'm reaching out to might actually do one for jor el if we approach it right
[4/23/2010 12:05:00 PM] ivan10000: Ill email you a study prepared by a consultancy on fund raising matters (confidential.. someone paid top $$$ for it)
[4/23/2010 12:06:31 PM] Ayse Sumer: sure - when I say fundraising I'm talking about a concert organized with donors for all the necessary equipment, space, and charging tickets to attendees - that would be the monies coming to the organization
[4/23/2010 12:06:44 PM] Ayse Sumer: anyhow what do you all think about theUS entity?
[4/23/2010 12:08:13 PM] ivan10000: Hierarchies are there just to slow down progress..
you need an organization as flat as possible...
I may sound like the hippy-anarchist here but I dont really see the point of any sort of registration at this stage yet..
anyway. that is just me.. I'm usually wrong.
[4/23/2010 12:09:09 PM] Suha Ülgen: Do we know everything we need to know about it to decide? Browsing the discussion I get the impression that we don't.
[4/23/2010 12:09:40 PM] Ayse Sumer: Its not a matter of wrong or right idea - just what works the best for us - consensus - also any form of an entity is min 6 months but we need to think about it and after deciding start the process
[4/23/2010 12:10:29 PM] Ayse Sumer: I will have further information next week - talking to another lawyer/tax consultant and the NGO based out of US that works in turkey experience will be interesting
[4/23/2010 12:10:31 PM] ivan10000: I just finished reading a book by Richard Branson.. it's called Screw it, Let's Do it!
The guy specifically advises start up and NGO's to forget about any sort of paperwork until it is really unavoidable.
He says many great ideas dont leave the idea stage because people start flying around like butterflies around a lamp and in the end they burn out.
[4/23/2010 12:11:36 PM] Ayse Sumer: I've read a bit about that as well - and am not disputing it at all - but if and when we start it would be good to be prepared and ready to go -
[4/23/2010 12:11:38 PM] Suha Ülgen: Can someone summarize how the exercise went? I don't have a good sense of what was accomplished. Let's assess the experience to build on what worked.
[4/23/2010 12:11:44 PM] Claire Berlinski: OK, I'm here.
[4/23/2010 12:11:54 PM] Claire Berlinski: I can go across the street to the Internet cafe ...
[4/23/2010 12:11:58 PM] Ayse Sumer: I'll let Victor and Claire tell that
[4/23/2010 12:12:07 PM] Claire Berlinski: but I may be stable for now.
[4/23/2010 12:12:26 PM] ivan10000: I wasn't part of it but I read this blog post
[4/23/2010 12:12:29 PM] ivan10000: http://www.journalistinturkey.com/blogs/party-lots-of-drunken-guests_1285/
[4/23/2010 12:12:35 PM] ivan10000: describes is pretty well I guess
[4/23/2010 12:13:00 PM] Claire Berlinski: OK ... the main problem was that we didn't have enough volunteers to input the data.
[4/23/2010 12:13:06 PM] Suha Ülgen: Thanks.
[4/23/2010 12:13:25 PM] Claire Berlinski: People did a great job with the Tweets, but it's hard to assess how usable the software was, because not enough people tried to use it.
[4/23/2010 12:14:05 PM] Claire Berlinski: What we need to do in the next exercise is go to the universities and get a class of students who will commit to doing that, maybe for extra-credit in a class.
[4/23/2010 12:14:12 PM] Ayse Sumer: Claire is having a hard time joining in - from what I read it was a good start but the problems seems to be on mapping and entering data
[4/23/2010 12:14:37 PM] Claire Berlinski: I asked people for feedback about why they didn't input -- was it confusing, were there problems ---
[4/23/2010 12:14:42 PM] Claire Berlinski: but the feedback was limited.
[4/23/2010 12:14:51 PM] Suha Ülgen: I am working on a project that addresses that issue.
[4/23/2010 12:15:04 PM] Claire Berlinski: Basically, I suspect people were comfortable doing what they already knew how to do --using Twitter --
[4/23/2010 12:15:12 PM] Claire Berlinski: but didn't want to learn to do something new.
[4/23/2010 12:15:29 PM] Claire Berlinski: Not surprising.
[4/23/2010 12:15:55 PM] Claire Berlinski: Yes, Ayse ... I'm here, can you see this?
[4/23/2010 12:16:23 PM] Claire Berlinski: Which issue exactly ...
[4/23/2010 12:16:57 PM] *** Ayse Sumer added Liam Hardy ***
[4/23/2010 12:17:21 PM] Ayse Sumer: how do you feel about the whole exercise?
[4/23/2010 12:17:34 PM] Ayse Sumer: yes
[4/23/2010 12:17:56 PM] Ayse Sumer: we started talking about the ngo status and moved on to the dry-run
[4/23/2010 12:18:27 PM] Claire Berlinski: I think the exercise was very successful given that it was the first time we tried the system.
[4/23/2010 12:18:43 PM] Claire Berlinski: Now we know what we need to do to make it work the next time.
[4/23/2010 12:19:05 PM] Suha Ülgen: Patrick Meier of CrisisMappersNet is putting together a University Network of Crisis Commons. I offered to help him get Bogazici University Kandilli Rasathanesi and Earthquake Research Institute on the network which he was very pleased to hear. BU/KOERI may very well be the university node we are looking for in Turkey.
[4/23/2010 12:19:08 PM] Ayse Sumer: Suha suggested that before we move on with any status declaration we shoud review the dry run
[4/23/2010 12:19:36 PM] Claire Berlinski: Great.
[4/23/2010 12:20:03 PM] Ayse Sumer: Look one other idea we did mention but did not dwell on is being part of a University - private - which would give us an interesting status
[4/23/2010 12:20:03 PM] Claire Berlinski: I spoke to Crisis Commons people in London and the US last week -- they know what we're doing and want to support it in any way they can.
[4/23/2010 12:20:18 PM] Liam Hardy: hello everyone. sorry for joining late.
[4/23/2010 12:20:30 PM] Suha Ülgen: Who is providing technical support for the Turkish instance of USHAHIDI?
[4/23/2010 12:20:37 PM] Claire Berlinski: Ayse, here's one of my -- hi Liam -- biggest concerns.
[4/23/2010 12:20:53 PM] Claire Berlinski: Knut Milbrecht, for now.
[4/23/2010 12:21:10 PM] Claire Berlinski: We have many people who can in principle help, but he's doing the heavy lifting.
[4/23/2010 12:21:39 PM] Claire Berlinski: OK, as status goes, here's my biggest concern.
[4/23/2010 12:21:44 PM] ivan10000: Claire.. that is ok.. there is always someone to do the heavy lifting
[4/23/2010 12:21:44 PM] Suha Ülgen: OK. I'll follow up with him separately on the technical issues. I notice that the site is rater sluggish in response.
[4/23/2010 12:22:30 PM] Claire Berlinski: We all know that the main problem, the biggest problem, is construction standards. That improving emergency preparation is critical, urgent,
[4/23/2010 12:22:49 PM] Claire Berlinski: but that the biggest problem by far is that so many buildings will collapse.
[4/23/2010 12:23:11 PM] Claire Berlinski: We also know -- as does anyone who lives in Turkey and has the slightest real experience with the country --
[4/23/2010 12:23:29 PM] Claire Berlinski: that the obstacles to solving this are corruption, bureaucracy, and political incompetence.
[4/23/2010 12:23:39 PM] Claire Berlinski: If we do not say this frankly,
[4/23/2010 12:23:57 PM] Claire Berlinski: we are not really addressing the heart of the problem. We're putting band aids on it.
[4/23/2010 12:24:24 PM] Claire Berlinski: When I spoke to the Crisis COmmons people on the conference call and said this, there was sort of a stunned silence,
[4/23/2010 12:24:40 PM] Claire Berlinski: and then I was quickly told that they "didn't want to talk about things like that, because they want to be non-political."
[4/23/2010 12:24:47 PM] Ayse Sumer: in that case we really need to reach out to architects and construction companies whom we can identify as responsible and knowledged people to work with us on the building codings to start with
[4/23/2010 12:25:02 PM] Claire Berlinski: OK, I get that ... but that's like saying, "We don't want to talk about the fact that you have cancer, so let's treat your acne."
[4/23/2010 12:25:32 PM] Claire Berlinski: I am worried about getting under an umbrella -- whether it's an NGO or a private university or whatever --
[4/23/2010 12:25:42 PM] Ayse Sumer: unfortunately there is no way we can get away from those dreaded things so we work with and around it and start a process
[4/23/2010 12:25:49 PM] Claire Berlinski: that says to us, "We can't say that because people will be offended."
[4/23/2010 12:26:17 PM] Claire Berlinski: Me, I'm offended by the idea of tens of thousands of kids being crushed to death because no one will say these things.
[4/23/2010 12:26:19 PM] Ayse Sumer: that is why I suggested that we become our own entity - boss
[4/23/2010 12:26:23 PM] ivan10000: Well... I have a little experience dealing with construction companie . Consruction has improved radically since the last earthquake.. everythin gthat is newly built
[4/23/2010 12:26:53 PM] ivan10000: is built up to very stringent specs... the problem are the mutahit and the gecekondu constructions
[4/23/2010 12:26:59 PM] Claire Berlinski: Ivan, it has to an extent -- but remember I have some experience with them too.
[4/23/2010 12:27:05 PM] Claire Berlinski: Some really bad experience.
[4/23/2010 12:27:15 PM] Claire Berlinski: Some of the companies are great and very responsible,
[4/23/2010 12:27:21 PM] Ayse Sumer: at least internally if we have strength and consensus we can show a good force to the outside
[4/23/2010 12:27:28 PM] Claire Berlinski: others are murderers, and they get away with it.
[4/23/2010 12:27:45 PM] Claire Berlinski: But my point is ... we have to be able to say the truth, or we're wasting our time.
[4/23/2010 12:28:34 PM] Ayse Sumer: look we all know the problems so lets get going and see where it leads us - lets start and I for one am not interesting in telling people what they want to hear - in other words lie and cheat
[4/23/2010 12:28:35 PM] Claire Berlinski: Whatever formal status we adopt, that's my main concern: Not putting ourselves in a situation where people can say to us, "You shouldn't say that because we're funded by X, or sponsored by the government," or "We're afraid people will get upset with us."
[4/23/2010 12:29:10 PM] Ayse Sumer: that is why we become our own entity
[4/23/2010 12:29:24 PM] Claire Berlinski: So ... I'm raising this issue as one that we need to really be aware of before getting under the umbrella, say, of a private university.
[4/23/2010 12:29:41 PM] Ayse Sumer: I understand that Claire
[4/23/2010 12:30:04 PM] Claire Berlinski: Because as people who really live in Turkey know (as opposed to people who think they know about Turkey), a lot of those universities are part of the crony system.
[4/23/2010 12:30:11 PM] Ayse Sumer: we have to put all options on the table and feel confident that we've not left anything out
[4/23/2010 12:31:04 PM] Ayse Sumer: Liam how come we dont see any of the things you are writing?
[4/23/2010 12:31:11 PM] Claire Berlinski: So the problems as I see it are: 1) how do we legally raise funds; 2) how do we minimize the bureaucratic hassle, and 3) how do we do this in the fastest, most efficient way possible.
[4/23/2010 12:31:24 PM] Liam Hardy: I'm just gonna jump in even though I don't know all that was previously discussed. I commute across the city for work from Beşiktaş to İkitele and see how terrible the situation is. I don't know if this is the vision you have for Jor El, but I see there needs to be some kind of system in place targeting and seeking out the opportunities to buy and demolish some of these buildings.
[4/23/2010 12:31:50 PM] Claire Berlinski: Ivan's answer -- no need for a formal organization at all -- won't work, because we cannot legally accept funds without one.
[4/23/2010 12:32:00 PM] Liam Hardy: is Jor El going to totally response oriented or prevention or both? just curious
[4/23/2010 12:32:30 PM] Claire Berlinski: Liam, that's a good point, but I think it would be good if you read in on the discussion boards -- a lot of this has been discussed.
[4/23/2010 12:32:57 PM] Ayse Sumer: so the question is do we want to be a US or TR entity? And then go from there
[4/23/2010 12:33:16 PM] Liam Hardy: ok - ill go back after the conversation and see what's been said
[4/23/2010 12:34:03 PM] Claire Berlinski: Ayse, from what I understand, we still don't have the information we need to make that decision, because from what I understood from Asli, the attorney with whom she spoke didn't feel she had enough information to advise us about that.
[4/23/2010 12:34:52 PM] Ayse Sumer: She does not have the US details, which I am complete by Monday and she can review it there
[4/23/2010 12:35:08 PM] Claire Berlinski: My gut strongly says a US entity, for a lot of reasons -- ease of establishment, independence, the possibility of making Jor El something broader than just an Istanbul-based organization. (I've already found people in Santo Domingo who are interested, for example.)
[4/23/2010 12:35:14 PM] Ayse Sumer: great grammer - I meant I will complete the info
[4/23/2010 12:35:34 PM] Claire Berlinski: I understood.
[4/23/2010 12:35:53 PM] Ayse Sumer: I agree that is what I had in mind expanding it to more than Istanbul
[4/23/2010 12:36:35 PM] Claire Berlinski: Ayse, did you get the draft mission statement?
[4/23/2010 12:36:44 PM] Ayse Sumer: no when did you send it?
[4/23/2010 12:36:59 PM] Ayse Sumer: I will work with the lawyer on that info
[4/23/2010 12:36:59 PM] Claire Berlinski: This morning.
[4/23/2010 12:37:04 PM] Ayse Sumer: to where?
[4/23/2010 12:37:19 PM] Claire Berlinski: It's too long,
[4/23/2010 12:37:36 PM] Claire Berlinski: but with a little cutting it should do the job -- to your e-mail address.
[4/23/2010 12:37:49 PM] Ayse Sumer: dont have it just checked not here - aysses@yahoo.com
[4/23/2010 12:38:30 PM] Claire Berlinski: I'll re-send it when the Internet's less buggy.
[4/23/2010 12:38:41 PM] Ayse Sumer: okey please do
[4/23/2010 12:38:48 PM] Claire Berlinski: I don't want to take the chance of getting disconnected now.
[4/23/2010 12:39:16 PM] Suha Ülgen: A bit late in responding but - I agree with Claire. We have to say the truth. But also we must find ways to empower the people to help themselves. My suggestion for getting BU/KOERI involved was to get them to facilitate the deployment of a Crisis Commons node to respond to an emergency. Nothing more at the moment. We would hope that the emergency occurs somewhere else in the world before it happens in Turkey so that we have some practice under our belt.
[4/23/2010 12:39:44 PM] Claire Berlinski: Yes, that's a great idea, Suha.
[4/23/2010 12:40:09 PM] Claire Berlinski: In fact, I couldn't agree more that working on a project like this when there's a real emergency is the only way to completely understand it ...
[4/23/2010 12:40:17 PM] Ayse Sumer: So I'm thinking that we all review everything by next week and then touch base - all please read posts as we post all info there
[4/23/2010 12:40:18 PM] Claire Berlinski: that, unfortunately, was how I learned.
[4/23/2010 12:40:43 PM] Ayse Sumer: yes its the fastest teacher
[4/23/2010 12:41:16 PM] Claire Berlinski: And if BU/KOERI people were working on something like this in real time, as it was deployed, they'd be really in good shape if they had to use it in Istanbul.
[4/23/2010 12:41:37 PM] Ayse Sumer: my friend who was working for a week in Haiti as a nurse just returned back and she still cant put into words what happened there
[4/23/2010 12:41:38 PM] Claire Berlinski: Not that, God forbid, I am wishing for an emergency anywhere in the world.
[4/23/2010 12:42:14 PM] Ayse Sumer: did you hear about the earthquake in Chile today?
[4/23/2010 12:42:28 PM] Claire Berlinski: This is why I go nuts when people tell me -- yes, I did, but it seems there were no reports of casualties.
[4/23/2010 12:42:54 PM] Claire Berlinski: it's why I go nuts when people tell me that we can't discuss the real issues because it's too "political."
[4/23/2010 12:43:03 PM] Suha Ülgen: That's interesting. GDACS did not send an alert message!
[4/23/2010 12:43:17 PM] Claire Berlinski: Children in Haiti having their limbs amputated WITHOUT ANESTHESIA.
[4/23/2010 12:43:17 PM] Ayse Sumer: it was 6.1
[4/23/2010 12:43:36 PM] Claire Berlinski: That's what happens when buildings collapse and there are no preparations for dealing with the aftermath.
[4/23/2010 12:44:04 PM] Claire Berlinski: Twitter, Suha --
[4/23/2010 12:44:19 PM] Claire Berlinski: it's far more reliable and fast than any other source of news.
[4/23/2010 12:44:59 PM] Ayse Sumer: yes Suha get on board please!
[4/23/2010 12:45:04 PM] Claire Berlinski: Follow my earthquake list and you'll be the first to know about any shaking, anywhere in the world.
[4/23/2010 12:46:00 PM] ivan10000: Well.. two nights ago our bed started shaking incontrolably.. Fulya was freaking out .. it turned out it was Chak Chak, our orange tabby scratching!
[4/23/2010 12:46:06 PM] Suha Ülgen: I should set my alert threshold lower AND get on twitter.
[4/23/2010 12:46:13 PM] Ayse Sumer: there was an article today I have yet to post on fb will send to you about the movement on and in earth
[4/23/2010 12:46:36 PM] Ayse Sumer: naughty Chak Chak~
[4/23/2010 12:46:53 PM] Claire Berlinski: I need to go soon to enjoy the family that is still alive, thank God ...
[4/23/2010 12:47:07 PM] Ayse Sumer: okey what is the next plan?
[4/23/2010 12:47:27 PM] Claire Berlinski: 1) Read the mission statement, which I'll resend in a moment.
[4/23/2010 12:47:32 PM] Claire Berlinski: 2) Send back suggestions,
[4/23/2010 12:47:39 PM] Claire Berlinski: 3) I'll post for group feedback.
[4/23/2010 12:47:59 PM] Ayse Sumer: we all get the necessary info - and then touch base next week
[4/23/2010 12:48:04 PM] Claire Berlinski: 4) Take this to lawyer in US and ask about getting a status there that would allow us to receive funds with minimum hassle.
[4/23/2010 12:48:11 PM] Claire Berlinski: 5) If we can find one, we do it.
[4/23/2010 12:48:13 PM] Ayse Sumer: tamam
[4/23/2010 12:48:18 PM] Claire Berlinski: 6) Start raising funds.
[4/23/2010 12:48:29 PM] Suha Ülgen: Good plan!
[4/23/2010 12:48:36 PM] Claire Berlinski: 7) Suha will get his university contacts involved in the project;
[4/23/2010 12:48:50 PM] Suha Ülgen: Agreed.
[4/23/2010 12:49:35 PM] Claire Berlinski: 9) I don't think my Internet connection is good enough for me to post these notes right now, but I will.
[4/23/2010 12:49:53 PM] Liam Hardy: good plan. this looks like a great project and hope i can contribute somehow later on
[4/23/2010 12:50:02 PM] Claire Berlinski: is everyone comfortable with having everything else posted?
[4/23/2010 12:50:11 PM] Claire Berlinski: Liam, we will totally put you to work.
[4/23/2010 12:50:21 PM] Claire Berlinski: We will give you as much work as you can handle.
[4/23/2010 12:50:22 PM] Liam Hardy: fine by me
[4/23/2010 12:50:34 PM] Suha Ülgen: Yes.
[4/23/2010 12:50:38 PM] Ayse Sumer: yes you being in Turkey helps
[4/23/2010 12:50:51 PM] Suha Ülgen: Who is in Turkey?
[4/23/2010 12:50:55 PM] Claire Berlinski: Liam, could you send me your regular e-mail address?
[4/23/2010 12:51:04 PM] Suha Ülgen: Oh. I get it.
[4/23/2010 12:51:16 PM] Claire Berlinski: I'll send these notes to this group first before posting. I usually am.
[4/23/2010 12:51:30 PM] Claire Berlinski: Right now I'm in the Dominican Republic.
[4/23/2010 12:51:36 PM] Liam Hardy: sure
[4/23/2010 12:51:49 PM] Ayse Sumer: Liam is
[4/23/2010 12:51:54 PM] Claire Berlinski: (I don't have a fetish for seismic zones, I'm just visiting my family.)
[4/23/2010 12:51:59 PM] Suha Ülgen: Claire, when are you going back to Turkey?
[4/23/2010 12:52:10 PM] Claire Berlinski: I have everyone else's e-mail address, right?
[4/23/2010 12:52:37 PM] Liam Hardy: I'm here until the end of July.
[4/23/2010 12:52:55 PM] Ayse Sumer: I'm there the whole month of June so I would love to take this opportunity and meet with you guys to go over things
[4/23/2010 12:52:59 PM] Claire Berlinski: Uh oh ... I think I've been cut off again. Anyone there?
[4/23/2010 12:53:49 PM] Claire Berlinski: Wow, this is like post-quake communication ... Facebook ok, e-mail out, Skype down, Twitter on and off.
[4/23/2010 12:53:56 PM] Ayse Sumer: for our marketing whether it be fund raising, bring awareness advertising etc..
[4/23/2010 12:54:17 PM] Ayse Sumer: it'll be like our cart visit
[4/23/2010 12:54:42 PM] Liam Hardy: ok- looking forward to catching up
[4/23/2010 12:54:53 PM] Claire Berlinski: May 10.
[4/23/2010 12:54:55 PM] ivan10000: ok guys.. a few months ago an amateur film maker made a short movie
[4/23/2010 12:54:57 PM] ivan10000: 5 minutes
[4/23/2010 12:55:00 PM] Ayse Sumer: will talk later Liam
[4/23/2010 12:55:15 PM] ivan10000: it showed he alien destruction of Montevideo
[4/23/2010 12:55:21 PM] ivan10000: the cost was 300 USD
[4/23/2010 12:55:25 PM] ivan10000: three hundred
[4/23/2010 12:55:28 PM] Ayse Sumer: wow that is good
[4/23/2010 12:55:32 PM] ivan10000: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dadPWhEhVk
[4/23/2010 12:55:38 PM] Ayse Sumer: do you know him?
[4/23/2010 12:55:42 PM] ivan10000: watch his... it goes to prove one point
[4/23/2010 12:55:51 PM] ivan10000: what is needed here is talent
[4/23/2010 12:55:56 PM] Ayse Sumer: I will
[4/23/2010 12:55:57 PM] ivan10000: not money
[4/23/2010 12:56:05 PM] ivan10000: check that link...
[4/23/2010 12:56:38 PM] ivan10000: Im just very concerned that the search for funds will slow down everything
[4/23/2010 12:56:43 PM] Ayse Sumer: yes but as you noted a video has to be made which requires funding whether it be 10 or 1000
[4/23/2010 12:56:43 PM] Liam Hardy: wish I could. youtube still blocked here.
[4/23/2010 12:56:49 PM] ivan10000: well
[4/23/2010 12:56:50 PM] Claire Berlinski: Right ... I'm going to sign off, if I haven't already been cut off,
[4/23/2010 12:57:00 PM] ivan10000: if it is 300 bucks Im happy to pay for it.. :)
[4/23/2010 12:57:01 PM] Claire Berlinski: because I'm not seeing any messages from you.
[4/23/2010 12:57:09 PM] Ayse Sumer: searching for funds should not stop us from doing other work
[4/23/2010 12:57:10 PM] Claire Berlinski: We'll schedule the next call by Doodle again, okay?
[4/23/2010 12:57:16 PM] Ayse Sumer: not at all I dont believe that
[4/23/2010 12:57:28 PM] Ayse Sumer: multitasking Victor on all fronts
[4/23/2010 12:57:36 PM] Ayse Sumer: then things will fall in to place
[4/23/2010 12:57:58 PM] Ayse Sumer: same thing with the status we need to continue the work as we learn of issues and opportunities
[4/23/2010 12:59:45 PM] Ayse Sumer: okey guys it seems that Claire is disconnected again - so lets plan on catching up by midweek - we'll post info on a followup skype call until then continue the hard work and have a wonderful weekend.........

Message for Jor El members

Hi everyone (a translation volunteer for this message would be great),

1) I'm with my family and their gorgeous but very active 13-month-old baby here in Santo Domingo. I've got only intermittent Internet access, so it's tricky to keep on top of everything. I'm still very much alive, though, and fascinated by all the new comments on the Facebook Wall, so keep them coming.

A few reminders:

1) Would everyone please remember to give the new website a test-drive and let Hilary Chan know how that went for you?

2) We'd like more feedback on the results of our USHAHIDI trial run last week. Was the system clear? Easy to use? Why do people think so few volunteers did the mapping -- was it too complicated? How would you suggest it be improved?

3) Don't forget to check the discussion tabs on fundraising videos and our legal status, where we're debating the merits of becoming an NGO or some other kind of formal organization. We'd like your suggestions and thoughts.

4) New members: Please introduce yourselves on the Wall and let us know what skills you might be able to contribute -- are you an architect, a translator, a structural engineer, a crisis-mapping specialist, just someone with an interest in this issue? The better we know you, the better we can put your skills to good use. Remember, this is a working group, not just a "show your support by joining" group, and we need everyone's participation to make this work. Right now, about 10 people are the really active members who are making things happen. I'd love to see this number double by the end of the week.

Want to become a member of the Jor El elite? Start by introducing yourself, then just dive in: If you see something that needs doing, don't bother to ask; we're not hierarchical or formal here, just jump in and do it. Don't worry, no one will get upset if you do it wrong -- you can't screw anything up. (I do recommend reading through the Wall, though, to get a sense of what's been done and what still needs doing.)

5) If you haven't secured your heavy items to your walls, arranged your furniture so that things won't fall on your bed if there's shaking, filled your apartment with food, water, flashlights, batteries and whatever medication you'd need in an emergency, and made an emergency contact plan with your family, do it today. And spread the word on your Facebook page. Remind another family to do it. Don't wait even another day. We need to be a group that walks the walk as well as we talk the talk. It keeps coming up that many of us know how important this is but still haven't done it. What use is Jor El if it's leadership is decapitated in an earthquake? Go on, do it today.

All my best from sunny, humid, tropical and slow-moving Santo Domingo,

Claire

Skype Conference Transcript

[15.04.10 17:56:04] Claire Berlinski: Hey everyone, I think we're here.
[15.04.10 17:56:17] Claire Berlinski: Ayse can't talk at the office, but can chat.
[15.04.10 17:56:22] Claire Berlinski: Is that okay?
[15.04.10 17:56:36] Ayse Sumer: hey all
[15.04.10 17:57:28] Claire Berlinski: Asli?
[15.04.10 17:57:37] Claire Berlinski: Hilal's not here yet.
[15.04.10 17:58:08] Claire Berlinski: Well, who'd like some tea?
[15.04.10 17:58:20] Claire Berlinski: Families well?
[15.04.10 17:58:28] Claire Berlinski: Glad we got the small talk out of the way.
[15.04.10 18:01:07] Hilal Ozcan: hi guys
[15.04.10 18:01:13] Ayse Sumer: and the cats
[15.04.10 18:01:18] Claire Berlinski: I love punctual people.
[15.04.10 18:01:22] Claire Berlinski: OK, let's start.
[15.04.10 18:01:42] Claire Berlinski: Ayse, would you please re-post what you said to me before?
[15.04.10 18:01:53] Ayse Sumer: okey
[15.04.10 18:02:05] Claire Berlinski: Meanwhile,
[15.04.10 18:02:17] Claire Berlinski: I've asked Mission 4636 for their budget figures,
[15.04.10 18:02:35] Ayse Sumer: [11:19:08 AM] Ayse Sumer: Go for the NGO status it has to be as the corporations and other entities fm the US and other countries cant really give
monies to a person.  It'll be good to legitimize, if for no other reason than to get the tax writeoff.  I believe the Rotary is one of the great sources to tap
in to - Turkish or international, I'm looking in to Govt funds from here such as USAID and State to see where we can tap in to.  There is a couple of
funds specifically geared for women such as the global fund for women and FINCA - it might be worth going there.  I'm looking at some of our
corporations who are our members as well and will proceed from there.
[15.04.10 18:02:35] Claire Berlinski: which should give us a good sense of what realistically is needed to run 4636 Istanbul -- working name.
[15.04.10 18:03:08] Claire Berlinski: I have contacts with Rotary here, actually.
[15.04.10 18:03:49] Ayse Sumer: The other idea was to find a couple of celebrity endorsers from the art/music world, sports and the media/academia which would grab peoples attention
[15.04.10 18:03:56] Ayse Sumer: have them in the video
[15.04.10 18:04:01] Claire Berlinski: Yes.
[15.04.10 18:04:16] Ayse Sumer: do a musical fundraising event open to the public
[15.04.10 18:04:32] Ayse Sumer: I can help with some of the people to talk to from here and am sure so can all of you
[15.04.10 18:04:47] Claire Berlinski: Let's specifically set up a plan for fundraising, though. How long does it take to get NGO status?
[15.04.10 18:04:49] Ayse Sumer: check out the young artists for Haiti they are good
[15.04.10 18:04:59] Ayse Sumer: anyone a lawyer among you
[15.04.10 18:05:12] Claire Berlinski: No, but I bet we can find one on that list.
[15.04.10 18:05:26] Claire Berlinski: Ivan?
[15.04.10 18:05:33] Ayse Sumer: I know tons here and there
[15.04.10 18:05:51] Ayse Sumer: I can check around and see which one has the gratis work they need to fulfill
[15.04.10 18:06:07] Claire Berlinski: Yes, that's what we need.
[15.04.10 18:06:17] ivan10000: what is a lawyer needed for?
[15.04.10 18:06:27] Ayse Sumer: to setup an ngo
[15.04.10 18:06:33] Claire Berlinski: To shepherd the process of applying for NGO status.
[15.04.10 18:06:36] Ayse Sumer: its best to use one
[15.04.10 18:06:48] Ayse Sumer: Asli are you there or not
[15.04.10 18:06:50] ivan10000: why?
[15.04.10 18:06:56] ivan10000: why do you need an NGO status?
[15.04.10 18:07:15] Ayse Sumer: Ivan especially with funding and legitimizing its better
[15.04.10 18:07:24] Claire Berlinski: "|t has to be as the corporations and other entities fm the US and other countries cant really give monies to a person."
[15.04.10 18:07:29] Claire Berlinski: That's the argument for.
[15.04.10 18:07:41] Claire Berlinski: The argument against is that NGOs are bureaucratic money-holes.
[15.04.10 18:07:41] ivan10000: well..
[15.04.10 18:07:50] ivan10000: allow me to disagree.. let me explain
[15.04.10 18:07:54] Claire Berlinski: And there are ... yes, please.
[15.04.10 18:08:03] ivan10000: a corporation is not goin to give money to anybody just because it is an NGO
[15.04.10 18:08:11] ivan10000: corporations are run by people
[15.04.10 18:08:14] ivan10000: and people trust people
[15.04.10 18:08:25] ivan10000: which is why investment banks
[15.04.10 18:08:47] ivan10000: seek star employees that come withah portfolio of investors
[15.04.10 18:08:51] ivan10000: of their own
[15.04.10 18:08:59] ivan10000: it's abotu people..
[15.04.10 18:09:10] ivan10000: legitimacy comes with the work you do
[15.04.10 18:09:13] ivan10000: not with your legal status..
[15.04.10 18:09:26] Claire Berlinski: What are the legal/tax obstacles to accepting money for this project?
[15.04.10 18:09:41] Ayse Sumer: with all due respect Ivan especially in Turkey right now where people do not trust people and there is so much speculation going on to create
from the beginning the image of a legitimate serious organization working for the people is better - yes this is a group run by the people
[15.04.10 18:09:42] Claire Berlinski: I mean, will anyone just sign a check to Jor El Istanbul?
[15.04.10 18:10:14] ivan10000: no
[15.04.10 18:10:16] Ayse Sumer: under what name are you going to accept - what bank account - who is going to be responsible and reliable
[15.04.10 18:10:28] ivan10000: but even if you call it Jor-El Dernek nobody is going to sign a check anyway
[15.04.10 18:10:34] ivan10000: unless they trust YOU
[15.04.10 18:10:37] Claire Berlinski: Sure.
[15.04.10 18:10:38] ivan10000: that's my point
[15.04.10 18:10:45] Claire Berlinski: But is there a DISADVANTAGE to being an NGO?
[15.04.10 18:11:01] Claire Berlinski: Or is it all benefit, apart from the paperwork?
[15.04.10 18:11:04] ivan10000: it has pros and cons
[15.04.10 18:11:11] Claire Berlinski: What are the cons?
[15.04.10 18:11:18] ivan10000: I personally see no benefit at an early stage
[15.04.10 18:11:26] ivan10000: is like going to a race wearing a sky jacket
[15.04.10 18:11:37] ivan10000: marathon wearing a sky jacket
[15.04.10 18:11:41] ivan10000: too heavy
[15.04.10 18:11:42] ivan10000: too hot
[15.04.10 18:11:46] ivan10000: too much stuff to carry around
[15.04.10 18:11:59] ivan10000: but again.. it may serve your purpose
[15.04.10 18:12:11] Claire Berlinski: But the key question is this:  Suppose we get funding -- to whom do they write the check?
[15.04.10 18:12:14] ivan10000: you may find soeone willin to put up some money right away
[15.04.10 18:12:22] Ayse Sumer: every status has its pros and cons that is why you shoul talk to a lawyer at least and see your options.
I've worked with ngo's local and international and if marketing and product placement is done well it should be to your benefit
[15.04.10 18:12:25] ivan10000: but I dont think that is how it realistically works
[15.04.10 18:12:52] Ayse Sumer: what is not how it realistically works
[15.04.10 18:13:07] Claire Berlinski: Knut? Hilal?
[15.04.10 18:13:22] Hilal Ozcan: i'm listening
[15.04.10 18:13:28] Knut Milbredt: me too
[15.04.10 18:13:48] Claire Berlinski: Ivan, what's the hot-heavy part of becoming an NGO?
[15.04.10 18:13:54] Claire Berlinski: Why is it so cumbersome?
[15.04.10 18:14:00] ivan10000: cumbersome?
[15.04.10 18:14:05] ivan10000: here is why
[15.04.10 18:14:06] Claire Berlinski: Marathon, etc.
[15.04.10 18:14:07] ivan10000: you need
[15.04.10 18:14:10] ivan10000: 1. a Lawyer
[15.04.10 18:14:13] ivan10000: 2. an accountant
[15.04.10 18:14:25] ivan10000: 3 monthly visits to the derneklar masali
[15.04.10 18:14:26] Claire Berlinski: Yes. And both would be working gratis, and thus slowly.
[15.04.10 18:14:40] Knut Milbredt: what si derneklar masali
[15.04.10 18:14:41] ivan10000: 4. Bi annual meetings
[15.04.10 18:14:48] Ayse Sumer: You need someone to do your accounting whether you are an ngo or not
[15.04.10 18:14:49] ivan10000: the board of associations
[15.04.10 18:14:54] ivan10000: Ayse.. yes
[15.04.10 18:14:56] ivan10000: that is true
[15.04.10 18:15:00] ivan10000: but not at this stage
[15.04.10 18:15:08] ivan10000: what accounting are you going to do when you have no money?
[15.04.10 18:15:10] ivan10000: :-)
[15.04.10 18:15:19] ivan10000: if you look at history
[15.04.10 18:15:23] ivan10000: and specially now
[15.04.10 18:15:26] Ayse Sumer: its too much of a chicken egg
[15.04.10 18:15:30] ivan10000: registration comes much later
[15.04.10 18:15:36] ivan10000: GreenPeace dinot register
[15.04.10 18:15:39] ivan10000: right away
[15.04.10 18:15:50] ivan10000: they did so years after starting operations
[15.04.10 18:16:03] Ayse Sumer: Greenpeace was not in Turkey Ivan
[15.04.10 18:16:14] ivan10000: oh.. burasi turkiye
[15.04.10 18:16:17] ivan10000: you are right..
[15.04.10 18:16:38] Ayse Sumer: find out what you can do as is - where do we all see ourselves
[15.04.10 18:16:43] Ayse Sumer: business plan stages
[15.04.10 18:17:15] Knut Milbredt: first you need a business plan for every kind of corporation you are
[15.04.10 18:17:17] Ayse Sumer: what exactly was that comment?  Burasi Turkiye?
[15.04.10 18:17:24] ivan10000: yes...
[15.04.10 18:17:39] ivan10000: you mentioned hat Greenpeace did not start
[15.04.10 18:17:40] ivan10000: in Turkey
[15.04.10 18:17:48] ivan10000: and I said ok... here it may be differnt
[15.04.10 18:17:50] Knut Milbredt: you can't hire sponsors w/o a BP
[15.04.10 18:17:52] ivan10000: or it may not
[15.04.10 18:18:12] ivan10000: Knut.. you can't hire sponsors.. period
[15.04.10 18:18:18] ivan10000: you must charm sponsors
[15.04.10 18:18:23] Ayse Sumer: true enough I've tried to find a student for you all to work with who can put toghether a business plan
[15.04.10 18:18:24] ivan10000: that your ideas and plans are great
[15.04.10 18:18:37] ivan10000: but people dont byy business plans
[15.04.10 18:18:38] Ayse Sumer: that is essetial - our mission/vision/plan a plan b
[15.04.10 18:18:40] Claire Berlinski: OK. Let's say we charm a sponsor.
[15.04.10 18:18:47] ivan10000: For example
[15.04.10 18:18:55] Knut Milbredt: but this doesn't change anything ... first there is a plan
[15.04.10 18:19:06] Claire Berlinski: Can said sponsor legally give Jor El, an undefined entity, money?
[15.04.10 18:19:14] ivan10000: no
[15.04.10 18:19:18] ivan10000: he can'
[15.04.10 18:19:18] Claire Berlinski: Will we have a different tax status as an NGO?
[15.04.10 18:19:23] ivan10000: he can't
[15.04.10 18:19:37] Ayse Sumer: we are not going to necessarily sell the business plan but the concept the plan is for us to give direction as a start up
[15.04.10 18:20:00] Ayse Sumer: so we are back to square one - no monnies without a status that they can identify
[15.04.10 18:20:36] ivan10000: Ayse.. this is like a business
[15.04.10 18:20:45] ivan10000: I tell you how venture capitalists work
[15.04.10 18:20:53] ivan10000: those are people who invest on bsiness
[15.04.10 18:20:57] ivan10000: instead of a bank
[15.04.10 18:21:06] Ayse Sumer: I suppose if one of the companies owned by members could take the money on Jor-El's behalf but this will create
a huge issue with their own tax and accounting
[15.04.10 18:21:12] ivan10000: because no bank invest in a business unless there is a collateral
[15.04.10 18:21:18] ivan10000: so look at it as venture capital
[15.04.10 18:21:26] Claire Berlinski: Hold on, Asli's here ... I think ... Asli?
[15.04.10 18:21:45] ivan10000: when a venture capitalists considers investing on a project he doesn't look at the business plan as much as he looks at the person
[15.04.10 18:21:53] ivan10000: same for hedge funds
[15.04.10 18:21:57] Ayse Sumer: who said anything about a bank investing - if you get people to give monies the companies will give it as part of their
annual social responsibility budget
[15.04.10 18:22:02] ivan10000: is an example...
[15.04.10 18:22:04] Ayse Sumer: others from their own interest and heart
[15.04.10 18:22:07] ivan10000: ok
[15.04.10 18:22:18] ivan10000: sorry.. didn't manage to explain myself.. apologies.
[15.04.10 18:23:15] Ayse Sumer: and then there was silence :)
[15.04.10 18:23:50] Claire Berlinski: Sorry, trying to add Asli.
[15.04.10 18:24:15] Ayse Sumer: she has a block in her status needs to change that in order to participate
[15.04.10 18:24:54] Knut Milbredt: welcome hilal
[15.04.10 18:25:04] Hilal Ozcan: hi there
[15.04.10 18:25:15] Claire Berlinski: Yeah, I just told her that ...
[15.04.10 18:26:47] Ayse Sumer: Look I suggest talking to a lawyer who is not going to take you for your dowry - I'll find one and proceed from there. 
Find out your options of different possible statuses available
[15.04.10 18:26:58] Ayse Sumer: and then proceed from there
[15.04.10 18:27:29] Ayse Sumer: in the meantime we should be going out and marketing and looking for sponsors and finding out what kind of options
there are both government and private
[15.04.10 18:28:14] Ayse Sumer: do the video - find a couple of celebrity endorsers these could get moving all at the same time.....have to multitask
[15.04.10 18:29:27] Ayse Sumer: I cant talk on the phone guys - dont have the equipment at home sorryyy
[15.04.10 18:30:06] Ayse Sumer: I meant at the office
[15.04.10 18:31:01] Asli Suner: I am here
[15.04.10 18:31:02] Ayse Sumer: okey we are but shall we use the other window just sent a bunch of things there
[15.04.10 18:31:18] Ayse Sumer: I can fm both windows
[15.04.10 18:31:59] Ayse Sumer: I cant talk fm the office dont have the equipment sorry
[15.04.10 18:32:56] Ayse Sumer: [12:20:52 PM] Ayse Sumer: Look I suggest talking to a lawyer who is not going to take you for your dowry -
I'll find one and proceed from there.  Find out your options of different possible statuses available
and then proceed from there
in the meantime we should be going out and marketing and looking for sponsors
and finding out what kind of options there are both government and private
do the video - find a couple of celebrity endorsers these could get moving all at the same time.....have to multitask
I cant talk on the phone guys - dont have the equipment at home sorryyy
[15.04.10 18:33:17] Ayse Sumer: If you are all talking I'll but out and you can let me know later what you plan to do
[15.04.10 18:33:19] Claire Berlinski: Are we all on chat now?
[15.04.10 18:33:41] Asli Suner: I am here
[15.04.10 18:33:49] Ayse Sumer: yep
[15.04.10 18:34:02] Claire Berlinski: OK. We're all here.
[15.04.10 18:34:17] Claire Berlinski: So. Asli, we're debating the pros and cons of getting NGO status.
[15.04.10 18:34:23] Asli Suner: OK
[15.04.10 18:34:33] Claire Berlinski: My sense is that unless there's some obvious drawback to getting it,
[15.04.10 18:34:45] Claire Berlinski: beyond having to spend some time hassling with the bureaucracy,
[15.04.10 18:34:56] Claire Berlinski: we either should go that route,
[15.04.10 18:35:02] Hilal Ozcan: i'm here
[15.04.10 18:35:08] Asli Suner: that'd be the only drawback, as I understand it, the bureaucracy
[15.04.10 18:35:26] Claire Berlinski: or figure out some other way to institutionalize in a way that allows us to receive funds.
[15.04.10 18:35:49] Claire Berlinski: Any other ideas for that?
[15.04.10 18:35:51] Asli Suner: One way we had discussed before was joining an existing NGO as a subbranch
[15.04.10 18:35:59] Ayse Sumer: yes again talk to someone who can give you that advise
[15.04.10 18:36:09] Ayse Sumer: and which one would that be?
[15.04.10 18:36:12] Asli Suner: MAY perhaps?
[15.04.10 18:36:15] Ayse Sumer: how about an association
[15.04.10 18:36:22] Ayse Sumer: rather than an ngo?
[15.04.10 18:36:28] ivan10000: SOME time :-) Bureaucracy never takes SOME time, it takes  A LOT of time. Ok, another drawback here, independence.
At some point Jor El will have ot point fingers at the government's inability to handle some issues. A drawback is.. they will try to shot you down.
[15.04.10 18:36:39] Claire Berlinski: My concern about that is that if any of those NGOs were doing such a great, efficient job, why would they need us?
[15.04.10 18:36:45] Asli Suner: I was hoping to get together wth Architecture fr Humanity Istanbul chapter here, but they are not yet an NGO
either and they weren't as resposnive as I hoped
[15.04.10 18:37:12] Claire Berlinski: The problem is that none of these NGOs are doing things fast enough, or efficiently enough.
[15.04.10 18:37:20] Claire Berlinski: And most NGOs don't, honestly.
[15.04.10 18:37:20] Ayse Sumer: I really think an association status might work
[15.04.10 18:37:35] Claire Berlinski: What is the difference between that and NGO status?
[15.04.10 18:37:35] Asli Suner: true, that's partially because of the bureaucracy
[15.04.10 18:37:41] Ayse Sumer: dont know what the different legal application is but
[15.04.10 18:37:55] Asli Suner: what's turkish equivalent of ' association' Ayse?
[15.04.10 18:37:55] Ayse Sumer: it works better - you'd have the business angle
[15.04.10 18:38:00] ivan10000: An association is an NGO
[15.04.10 18:38:06] ivan10000: in Turkey you have two kinds
[15.04.10 18:38:10] ivan10000: of legal sructures
[15.04.10 18:38:12] ivan10000: Dernek
[15.04.10 18:38:14] ivan10000: and Vakif
[15.04.10 18:38:20] Claire Berlinski: Right, got it.
[15.04.10 18:38:21] ivan10000: Dernek = Association
[15.04.10 18:38:27] Ayse Sumer: yes but there are trade ngo's now Vakif is way too differnt
[15.04.10 18:38:30] ivan10000: Vakif = foundation
[15.04.10 18:38:48] Ayse Sumer: as the name states that is another ball game all together
[15.04.10 18:38:51] Ayse Sumer: it could worlk
[15.04.10 18:38:57] Asli Suner: What we were looking into was a 'dernek'
[15.04.10 18:39:08] Claire Berlinski: Hi Suha.
[15.04.10 18:39:18] Suha Ülgen: Hi there.
[15.04.10 18:39:24] Claire Berlinski: I assume you're here for the conference call.
[15.04.10 18:39:38] Suha Ülgen: Yes, are you going to patch me in?
[15.04.10 18:39:42] Claire Berlinski: You're in.
[15.04.10 18:39:45] Claire Berlinski: We're using chat.
[15.04.10 18:39:51] Suha Ülgen: OK.
[15.04.10 18:39:57] Claire Berlinski: Everyone, please meet Suha ..
[15.04.10 18:40:02] Ayse Sumer: Dernekler and Vakiflar kanunlari differ in financial terms
[15.04.10 18:40:04] Ayse Sumer: hi suha
[15.04.10 18:40:07] Suha Ülgen: Hi everyone.
[15.04.10 18:40:12] Asli Suner: Hi Suha
[15.04.10 18:40:24] Ayse Sumer: but I'm not an expert on the differences
[15.04.10 18:40:26] Suha Ülgen: Sorry I am late.
[15.04.10 18:40:27] Claire Berlinski: Suha, perhaps you could introduce yourself.
[15.04.10 18:41:35] Claire Berlinski: Briefly, we're discussing the options for institutionalizing Jor El ... as an NGO, the various legal structures.
[15.04.10 18:42:15] Ayse Sumer: wow that is one long introduction
[15.04.10 18:42:39] Suha Ülgen: I am chatting from Geneva. I work for the UN. I have extensive experience in disaster preparednes and response.
I used to be the Technical Coordinator with OCHA responsible for setting up Humanitarian Information Centers (HIC).
Now I work for the Asisstant Secretary General and Chief Information Communication Technology Officer of the UN Secretariat.
Marla Petal is my wife. That's all for now.
[15.04.10 18:43:09] Ayse Sumer: Hello fm one UN person to another
[15.04.10 18:43:24] Claire Berlinski: Thanks! OK ... perhaps you could weigh in on the debate.
[15.04.10 18:43:43] Claire Berlinski: Is there a compelling reason to choose one form of legal structure for Jor El over another?
[15.04.10 18:44:13] Suha Ülgen: I am not an expert on legal matters especially if you are talking about the Turkish context.
[15.04.10 18:44:37] Hilal Ozcan: same reason i'm silent.
[15.04.10 18:44:38] Claire Berlinski: We're discussing fundraising, and starting with the question -- what does Jor El need to be, to raise funds.
[15.04.10 18:45:21] Asli Suner: I don't think VAKIF would be the way to go.
[15.04.10 18:45:30] Knut Milbredt: suha, if you omit the turkish context, what will be your proposal?
[15.04.10 18:46:06] Suha Ülgen: An NGO of course. Or work under an existing NGO. Marla may be able to help.
[15.04.10 18:46:14] Knut Milbredt: ok
[15.04.10 18:46:48] Claire Berlinski: You say of course ... Ivan is arguing that the cost of doing this, in terms of bureaucracy and time-wasting, is quite high.
[15.04.10 18:47:12] Claire Berlinski: As for working under an existing NGO:  Do any come to mind?
[15.04.10 18:47:19] Suha Ülgen: I understand it is very difficult and expensive to establish a Vakif in Turkey. Although there are a couple of exiisting ones
which would look favorably to the idea.
[15.04.10 18:47:28] ivan10000: Suha, Ivan here, you know me as Viktor Larkhill, the crazy dog rescuer.. Dont you think that at this stage the focus of the group
should be on creating a cohesive group AND building a community around it? there is always tiem to register..
[15.04.10 18:47:51] Knut Milbredt: @claire I think whatever you do it will be associated with terms of bureaucracy and time-wasting
[15.04.10 18:48:05] Suha Ülgen: Hi Victor. It is a small world indeed.
[15.04.10 18:48:32] Ayse Sumer: how about establishing it in the US?  and having it be the arm?  Is that going to be politically incorrect?
[15.04.10 18:48:49] Claire Berlinski: Ayse -- politically incorrect or no,
[15.04.10 18:48:56] Ayse Sumer: its cheaper and easier here
[15.04.10 18:49:10] Claire Berlinski: it's a fact that the energy behind this is largely coming from the Turkish diaspora and Americans.
[15.04.10 18:49:19] Claire Berlinski: So that idea is interesting.
[15.04.10 18:49:53] Ayse Sumer: and sometimes selling this entity can be more "sexy" in Turkey
[15.04.10 18:49:56] Suha Ülgen: I agreed, the first thing is to build the base to support a sustainable program.
[15.04.10 18:49:58] Claire Berlinski: Anyone see a downside to it beyond the obvious,
[15.04.10 18:50:11] Claire Berlinski: which of course will be the charge that this is an imperialist plot?
[15.04.10 18:50:35] Asli Suner: That'll be the case for sure
[15.04.10 18:50:44] Claire Berlinski: It will be the case no matter what.
[15.04.10 18:50:50] Hilal Ozcan: what are other examples of US-based NGOs functioning for Turkish problems?
[15.04.10 18:50:56] Claire Berlinski: We may as well have the benefits.
[15.04.10 18:51:19] Ayse Sumer: We have ATAA, Turkish Cultural Foundation, Turkish Coalition of America we are not turkish but work for the cause
[15.04.10 18:51:22] Claire Berlinski: I can't think of any, but that doesn't mean there aren't any, or that it's a bad idea.
[15.04.10 18:51:33] ivan10000: Guys.. build the base to support a sustainable program.. in other words.. people, team, ideas, concept, drive... none of this comes with legal status
[15.04.10 18:51:35] Claire Berlinski: I'm liking this idea.
[15.04.10 18:51:38] Hilal Ozcan: i think it's a great idea.
[15.04.10 18:51:49] Claire Berlinski: No one's saying we shouldn't do that, Ivan.
[15.04.10 18:51:55] Claire Berlinski: Just that we need to do both.
[15.04.10 18:52:11] Ayse Sumer: Ivan its a package and we need to multitask at the same time
[15.04.10 18:52:26] Claire Berlinski: I agree.
[15.04.10 18:52:39] Claire Berlinski: OK. What is the next step we need to take to do it this way?
[15.04.10 18:52:44] Claire Berlinski: Because I like the idea.
[15.04.10 18:52:52] Asli Suner: To make things clear - why we are after becoming an NGO is so that we can get some funding, is that right?
[15.04.10 18:53:03] Ayse Sumer: I will talk to our General Counsel and ask what we should do
[15.04.10 18:53:10] Suha Ülgen: I know ATAA was interested in helping Turkey prepare for a disaster. We have good friends leading ATAA we can talk to get their input.
[15.04.10 18:53:11] Claire Berlinski: So that if we get funding, it goes to something that can legally receive it,
[15.04.10 18:53:23] Claire Berlinski: as opposed to Claire Berlinski's bank account,
[15.04.10 18:53:30] ivan10000: ok
[15.04.10 18:53:33] Claire Berlinski: which would suit me fine, but cause some PR problems.
[15.04.10 18:53:35] Ayse Sumer: Suha I am in the thick of things with ATAA and their management here in Washignton
[15.04.10 18:53:36] Claire Berlinski: And tax issues.
[15.04.10 18:53:45] ivan10000: let me make a point and I willshut up on this issue...
[15.04.10 18:53:52] ivan10000: ok, maybe in the old times it was like that.. today the internet has changed everything.
Everyhing is much faster and agile. Most of you know me as the founder of Let's Adopt!... the organization started
with two people and turned into this:  http://www.myletsadopt.com/
[15.04.10 18:53:56] Claire Berlinski: You don't have to shut up ...
[15.04.10 18:54:14] ivan10000: We are rescuing in so mnany countries withso many people involved without registration..
[15.04.10 18:54:18] ivan10000: its the IDEA
[15.04.10 18:54:35] ivan10000: find a way to spread the IDEA and you will win people and the fight.
[15.04.10 18:54:51] Claire Berlinski: How's that incompatible with what we're saying?
[15.04.10 18:54:57] Asli Suner: I actually like that
[15.04.10 18:54:59] Hilal Ozcan: so how did you spread the idea then?
[15.04.10 18:55:06] ivan10000: Ideas are incompatible with bureacracy at an early stage
[15.04.10 18:55:40] Ayse Sumer: you are a hopeless romantic Ivan, we should not shut out any idea!  and use every avenue - the realistic and the social
[15.04.10 18:56:00] Ayse Sumer: you cant push aside life's beaurocracies
[15.04.10 18:56:09] Claire Berlinski: It's true, he is.
[15.04.10 18:56:13] Claire Berlinski: Here's the thing.
[15.04.10 18:56:15] Asli Suner: Practically we could have a paypal account righ now on the blog
[15.04.10 18:56:17] Claire Berlinski: We need money.
[15.04.10 18:56:39] Ayse Sumer: Opps maybe should not bringin philosophies in to this discussion
[15.04.10 18:56:44] Claire Berlinski: I can't continue doing this without some money. It's a full-time job.
[15.04.10 18:57:00] Ayse Sumer: yes we are back to square one
[15.04.10 18:57:08] Claire Berlinski: We need money for things like television commercials,
[15.04.10 18:57:11] Claire Berlinski: posters,
[15.04.10 18:57:18] Claire Berlinski: photocopies,
[15.04.10 18:57:25] Claire Berlinski: Internet connections,
[15.04.10 18:57:30] Asli Suner: or sponsors
[15.04.10 18:57:44] Hilal Ozcan: can we start creating a budget? that will also help with grant application.
[15.04.10 18:57:47] Claire Berlinski: If we have sponsors,
[15.04.10 18:57:59] Claire Berlinski: Yes -- as I said before, I asked Mission 4636 for their budget figures,
[15.04.10 18:58:05] Claire Berlinski: which we can start with as a model.
[15.04.10 18:58:13] Ayse Sumer: Yes a budget per project is needed
[15.04.10 18:58:20] Hilal Ozcan: what is mission 4636?
[15.04.10 18:58:37] Claire Berlinski: We are going to need programmers, Knut is not enough manpower, however talented he is.
[15.04.10 18:58:38] Asli Suner: but even for sponsors we will need a budget proposal
[15.04.10 18:58:52] Claire Berlinski: Mission 4636 is the USHAHIDI platform in Haiti.
[15.04.10 18:59:11] Claire Berlinski: Staffed with a VERY large number of programmers, coordinators, etc.
[15.04.10 18:59:28] Ayse Sumer: it does not need to be a complicated budget
[15.04.10 18:59:46] Hilal Ozcan: so they came up with the budget after the earthquake.
[15.04.10 19:00:03] Suha Ülgen: Let's look for a sponsor for the short term and prepare a full-fledged proposal for the longer term. All while we are building the idea as Viktor puts it.
[15.04.10 19:00:24] ivan10000: Sorry Im back!... TV Commercials!!!! Why!!!!
[15.04.10 19:00:25] Knut Milbredt: That sounds good
[15.04.10 19:00:31] Ayse Sumer: exactly short term, long term, medium term and proposals per project
[15.04.10 19:00:48] ivan10000: Claire.. do you konw the ROI of a TV commercial?
[15.04.10 19:00:52] Claire Berlinski: OK. Because Ivan, that will be the single most effective way of getting the information to people who need it most.
[15.04.10 19:00:58] ivan10000: 80% of the cases is negative..
[15.04.10 19:01:06] Suha Ülgen: We also have a division of labor among ourselves. Claire cannot do everything.
[15.04.10 19:01:45] Ayse Sumer: I agree - lets put a plan together now and divide the jobs
[15.04.10 19:02:02] Ayse Sumer: 1.  Status research - in the US I shall check with counsel
[15.04.10 19:02:08] Claire Berlinski: Let's debate the TV commercials later ... for now, let me keep on Francesca to get me 4636's figures.
[15.04.10 19:02:17] Asli Suner: Commercials are highly competetively priced - unless digiturk perhaps sponsors us !
[15.04.10 19:02:20] Ayse Sumer: 2. In Turkey Asli if I give you the name of a lawyer would you talk to them
[15.04.10 19:02:34] Asli Suner: Sure
[15.04.10 19:02:54] Ayse Sumer: 3. what is the most important on the agenda? Sponsor?
[15.04.10 19:03:16] Claire Berlinski: Let's figure out exactly what would be required legally to become 1) an NGO based here; 2) one that's US-based, or 3) another kind of entity.
[15.04.10 19:03:25] Ayse Sumer: Let everyone take a couple of the options mentioned and contact them, Rotary,
[15.04.10 19:03:38] Claire Berlinski: Sponsor, be it corporate or funding from, say, the USG.
[15.04.10 19:03:45] Ayse Sumer: I will look in to USG and other local entitities for grants and funds
[15.04.10 19:04:04] Claire Berlinski: Hilal, why don't you cover the NSF.
[15.04.10 19:04:10] Ayse Sumer: I cant reach out to my corporates yet until after June
[15.04.10 19:04:16] Claire Berlinski: I've already made contact with PDI.
[15.04.10 19:04:21] Asli Suner: I can contact Lions also, my aunt works with them
[15.04.10 19:04:42] Hilal Ozcan: NSF and alternate sources, I will cover.
[15.04.10 19:04:46] Asli Suner: But for oall of this, we wnned a proposal document, don't we?
[15.04.10 19:05:10] Ayse Sumer: yes we do!
[15.04.10 19:05:13] Claire Berlinski: Yes we do!
[15.04.10 19:05:26] Asli Suner: I think, that's n0.1 in the agenda then
[15.04.10 19:05:30] Claire Berlinski: Yep.
[15.04.10 19:05:32] Ayse Sumer: My tasks:I will talk to ATAA and other TR related entities here, General Counsel, USG funding
[15.04.10 19:05:43] Claire Berlinski: I'll get sample budget figures,
[15.04.10 19:05:50] Ayse Sumer: Even if it is a short precise marketing tool
[15.04.10 19:05:55] Claire Berlinski: and work on a general proposal text.
[15.04.10 19:06:36] Claire Berlinski: Our budget will be a bit different from 4636's, because we have a very different kind of PR challenge.
[15.04.10 19:06:56] Hilal Ozcan: we may need to come with an outline of the items for the grant, just to be ready in advance before deadlines approach.
[15.04.10 19:07:22] Hilal Ozcan: i can put together the outline.
[15.04.10 19:07:34] Ayse Sumer: Claire I can give you the name of a good PR firm whom you can talk and danismak with they'll help and wont ask for money immediately
[15.04.10 19:07:55] Claire Berlinski: Now, don't forget -- I'm leaving for the DR and Haiti on Sunday.
[15.04.10 19:07:55] Suha Ülgen: I will look into aligning with an existing NGO or Vakif and explore potential "angels" to pitch in for the short-term.
[15.04.10 19:08:03] Hilal Ozcan: we would need teamwork to progress with the draft proposal.
[15.04.10 19:08:07] Claire Berlinski: I'll be back on May 10,
[15.04.10 19:08:17] Claire Berlinski: and should have Internet coverage most of that time,
[15.04.10 19:08:28] Claire Berlinski: but obviously I can't meet anyone in person.
[15.04.10 19:08:41] Asli Suner: That shouldn't be a problem
[15.04.10 19:08:51] Ayse Sumer: And I'll leave for TR around the 20th of May so maybe when I'm there we can have a major powwow
[15.04.10 19:09:22] Asli Suner: Ayse - you said you knew of a lawyer whom I can talk to?
[15.04.10 19:09:44] Ayse Sumer: I'll try and get some answers for you by then and yes Asli I will send you her contact info separately
[15.04.10 19:09:56] Asli Suner: She is in istanbul?
[15.04.10 19:09:59] Claire Berlinski: Could you all send me your e-mail addresses?
[15.04.10 19:10:07] Ayse Sumer: yep infact maybe we can do a conference call sometime
[15.04.10 19:10:08] Asli Suner: xxxxxxxxxx
[15.04.10 19:10:11] Claire Berlinski: We should create a small working group for this.
[15.04.10 19:10:11] Knut Milbredt: kxxxxxxxxxx
[15.04.10 19:10:11] Hilal Ozcan: xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[15.04.10 19:10:16] Claire Berlinski: Thanks.
[15.04.10 19:10:18] Ayse Sumer: axxxxxxxxxxxx
[15.04.10 19:11:17] Ayse Sumer: So shall we say that we try and meet again via skype next weekend and go over our findings?
[15.04.10 19:11:18] Claire Berlinski: Suha? Could I get your address, too?
[15.04.10 19:11:20] Suha Ülgen: xxxxxxxxxxx
[15.04.10 19:11:21] Hilal Ozcan: what about regular calls, same timee ach week?
[15.04.10 19:11:36] Ayse Sumer: that's an idea too
[15.04.10 19:11:37] Claire Berlinski: Sounds good to me.
[15.04.10 19:11:39] Asli Suner: we can try
[15.04.10 19:11:52] Claire Berlinski: Does anyone object if I post this chat as the meeting minutes?
[15.04.10 19:12:00] Suha Ülgen: Try to announce the conference call a bit earlier please.
[15.04.10 19:12:06] Claire Berlinski: I did!
[15.04.10 19:12:19] Suha Ülgen: I missed it. sorry.
[15.04.10 19:12:22] Claire Berlinski: It was posted several days ago, I think.
[15.04.10 19:12:24] Ayse Sumer: No - I'm in NY the last weekend but 24 is good
[15.04.10 19:12:42] Claire Berlinski: It's okay ... things are getting missed a lot. It will be better when Hilary's got the site up and running.
[15.04.10 19:12:59] Ayse Sumer: we can actually talk over the weekend
[15.04.10 19:13:22] Claire Berlinski: We have a conference call with Crisis Camps on Saturday, tentatively.
[15.04.10 19:13:32] Claire Berlinski: I'm leaving on Sunday ...
[15.04.10 19:13:38] Suha Ülgen: NY is calling. I'll try to get back as soon as I can.
[15.04.10 19:13:44] Ayse Sumer: oopps forgot
[15.04.10 19:13:48] Claire Berlinski: Say hi for us ...
[15.04.10 19:13:55] Ayse Sumer: :0
[15.04.10 19:14:17] Claire Berlinski: OK. So let's chat at this time next week.
[15.04.10 19:14:32] Claire Berlinski: Has anyone said anything they want me to keep out of the minutes?
[15.04.10 19:14:35] Claire Berlinski: Ivan?
[15.04.10 19:14:36] Asli Suner: Sounds good
[15.04.10 19:14:36] Claire Berlinski: Knut?
[15.04.10 19:14:40] Claire Berlinski: Ayse?
[15.04.10 19:14:41] Claire Berlinski: Hilal?
[15.04.10 19:14:43] Asli Suner: I am good
[15.04.10 19:14:48] Claire Berlinski: Asli?
[15.04.10 19:14:51] Knut Milbredt: yes
[15.04.10 19:14:53] Asli Suner: No problem posting for me
[15.04.10 19:14:55] Ayse Sumer: How about the 22nd its also earth day!
[15.04.10 19:14:57] Claire Berlinski: OK.
[15.04.10 19:15:13] ivan10000: yes
[15.04.10 19:15:14] Hilal Ozcan: i would say 12.30pm would work better for me, if we do it every Thursday.
[15.04.10 19:15:13] Claire Berlinski: That's fine by me too.
[15.04.10 19:15:27] Hilal Ozcan: is it too late for you guys?
[15.04.10 19:15:38] Ayse Sumer: yes since its work time here noon is good lunch break
[15.04.10 19:15:45] Claire Berlinski: What time is that in the DR ... 11:30?
[15.04.10 19:15:49] Claire Berlinski: No, 1:30.
[15.04.10 19:15:53] Claire Berlinski: Right?
[15.04.10 19:15:58] Ayse Sumer: I think its only one hour fm East coast
[15.04.10 19:16:07] Ayse Sumer: 11:30?
[15.04.10 19:16:13] Ayse Sumer: texas time
[15.04.10 19:16:14] Claire Berlinski: Well, let's standardize to Istanbul time.
[15.04.10 19:16:22] Knut Milbredt: UTC?
[15.04.10 19:16:22] Hilal Ozcan: 12.30 texas time?
[15.04.10 19:16:22] Asli Suner: Ayse and Hilal - are you both in the east coast?
[15.04.10 19:16:23] Claire Berlinski: 7:30 Istanbul time.
[15.04.10 19:16:31] Claire Berlinski: Hilal's in Texas.
[15.04.10 19:16:33] Hilal Ozcan: i'm central time.
[15.04.10 19:16:36] Asli Suner: Fine by me
[15.04.10 19:16:43] Ayse Sumer: Im eastcoast
[15.04.10 19:16:57] Claire Berlinski: OK. We're good, I think.
[15.04.10 19:16:58] Hilal Ozcan: ayse, would it work for you 1.30pm your time?
[15.04.10 19:16:59] Suha Ülgen: I am in Geneva
[15.04.10 19:16:59] Ayse Sumer: its 12:30 my time and its fine
[15.04.10 19:17:24] Ayse Sumer: 7:30 Istanbul is 12:30 here
[15.04.10 19:17:34] Claire Berlinski: Indeed it is.
[15.04.10 19:17:46] Claire Berlinski: Let's say 7:30 Istanbul, Earth Day?
[15.04.10 19:17:50] Claire Berlinski: The 22nd?
[15.04.10 19:18:03] Asli Suner: it's a date
[15.04.10 19:18:04] Ayse Sumer: got it 22 April - 7:30 Istanbul time we meet
[15.04.10 19:18:14] Suha Ülgen: Confirmed.
[15.04.10 19:18:21] Claire Berlinski: OK. We'll all report back on our tasks.
[15.04.10 19:18:23] Knut Milbredt: 22nd 7:30pm IST time - ok
[15.04.10 19:18:27] Hilal Ozcan: i have a commitment thursday mornings, i can try next week but in the long term i would need to shift the mtg time for an hour.
[15.04.10 19:18:36] Ayse Sumer: Operation Earth Day has officially begun
[15.04.10 19:18:41] Claire Berlinski: OK. We'll deal with that when it happens.
[15.04.10 19:18:51] Claire Berlinski: Meanwhile,
[15.04.10 19:19:00] Claire Berlinski: has everyone nailed his or her furniture to their walls?
[15.04.10 19:19:08] Claire Berlinski: Stocked up on water?
[15.04.10 19:19:14] Claire Berlinski: Flashlights by the bed?
[15.04.10 19:19:23] Claire Berlinski: Asli -- did you have that done?
[15.04.10 19:19:27] Ayse Sumer: we actually have to do that for the hurricane season
[15.04.10 19:19:53] Claire Berlinski: I hear the sound of an embarassd Asli.
[15.04.10 19:20:04] Asli Suner: that's right
[15.04.10 19:20:17] Suha Ülgen: How about an out-of-town phone number and contact for the family to agree on?
[15.04.10 19:20:28] Claire Berlinski: Check!
[15.04.10 19:20:53] Claire Berlinski: As well as a meeting point here in Istanbul.
[15.04.10 19:21:12] Claire Berlinski: Cagri and I agreed that we'd meet at the base of Tunel, if all systems failed.
[15.04.10 19:21:32] Ayse Sumer: YOu know the safest point in Istanbul is Gumussuyu!
[15.04.10 19:21:46] Asli Suner: How do you know that?
[15.04.10 19:21:50] Claire Berlinski: Sabiha Airport looks pretty good ...
[15.04.10 19:21:56] Ayse Sumer: its one of the most stable locations - learned that at the last earquake I lived there
[15.04.10 19:22:00] Asli Suner: too far too reach
[15.04.10 19:22:09] Claire Berlinski: Hey, Ivan, you still there?
[15.04.10 19:22:16] Asli Suner: Well I am in Cihangir, not too far from Gumussuyu
[15.04.10 19:22:19] Ayse Sumer: is everyone on the Asian side
[15.04.10 19:22:27] Claire Berlinski: No, I'm in Beyoglu.
[15.04.10 19:22:32] Ayse Sumer: probably on the right rock point
[15.04.10 19:22:39] Suha Ülgen: I have to go. If your share this chat in its totality. I can follow it later. Thanks to you all.
[15.04.10 19:22:40] Claire Berlinski: Ayse, I'm not going to post your cell number to the board.
[15.04.10 19:22:46] Claire Berlinski: OK!
[15.04.10 19:22:58] Ayse Sumer: thanks just for you guys
[15.04.10 19:22:58] Claire Berlinski: I should go too.
[15.04.10 19:23:02] Asli Suner: Same here
[15.04.10 19:23:02] Asli Suner: Same here
[15.04.10 19:23:05] Claire Berlinski: Asli, call Cemal.
[15.04.10 19:23:09] Ayse Sumer: ciao and good luck to all
[15.04.10 19:23:13] Asli Suner: I will !! Thanks ..;)
[15.04.10 19:23:24] Claire Berlinski: Good night guys ...
[15.04.10 19:23:29] Asli Suner: Talk soon - Good Night!
[15.04.10 19:23:28] Hilal Ozcan: taker care guys!
[15.04.10 19:23:32] Knut Milbredt: bye to all
[15.04.10 19:23:41] Asli Suner: bye
[15.04.10 19:23:49] Ayse Sumer: hasta la vista